Orcish Navy

[Maul]

could the orcish navy be reformed? I mean it served a huge role in the second war.

[Hidden]

could the orcish navy be reformed? I mean it served a huge role in the second war.

...That would be alot of green seamen. D:

www.instantrimshot.com

[Mark_Romaneck]

by the looks of it the Forsaken have taken the role of the pirates of the Horde Yarrr

[ARM3481]

They already must have reestablished their navy to some degree. A chunk of the orcs' fleet lies ruined by the Kvaldir at Garrosh's Landing in the Borean Tundra after it initially carried the Warsong Offensive up to Northrend.

So despite the lack of frequent visible representation in-game at this point, both the Alliance and Horde seem to have at least a fairly sizable naval presence on Azeroth. Enough to ship their armies around the world en masse, at least.

[RobLore]

I want the Trolls to lead the forces in the South Seas :D
The Darkspear Isles shall rise again! Also I think that the Darkspear Trolls should settle in Tel Abim. In wc4/WoW 2, Tel'abim should be just off the coast of Kalimdor.

But yeah, the Forsaken has the Hordes most powerful navy. The Scourge even offered them reinvited into the Scourge because of their navy.

[Yuber8900]

What navy? Tides of Shit says what the orcs had were a lot of boats not a navy.

And at least the Alliance has ports in WoW. Horde has none but they have naval power capable of beating the Alliance? Ugh.

[Maul]

i know for a fact they had a navy in the second war, probably the goblins built the ships, but what the horde could get instead of a new Navy would be an Orcish Air Fleet. well it would be called the Horde Air Fleet...

[Yuber8900]

i know for a fact they had a navy in the second war, probably the goblins built the ships, but what the horde could get instead of a new Navy would be an Orcish Air Fleet. well it would be called the Horde Air Fleet...

A navy requires discipline and skill and strategy to be a navy. According to Tides of Shit the Orcs had a bunch of boats that got sunk by a "brilliant" trap.

[Sports72Xtrm]

Who needs a navy when you got big massive war turtles, wyverns, spears, and good old voodoo magic. They need nothing more than the warrior spirit of the Horde.

OH WAIT THEY DO HAVE A NAVY. Forsaken have a fleet of ships.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

And at least the Alliance has ports in WoW. Horde has none but they have naval power capable of beating the Alliance? Ugh.

Just because none appear in WoW does not mean they have none.

[RobLore]

Exactly.

Or where do you think all the Forsaken ships in the Howling Fjord came from? -.-

Also Vengeance Landing in Northrend is perhaps the only Horde base to have a dock. There are even 4 NPCs in it (the ship at the dock) that do nothing and some Dark Rangers and other Forsaken units on it >.>

[Yuber8900]

Just because none appear in WoW does not mean they have none.

Ah yes, then I suppose the Alliance has working ports in Westfall despite it having been overrun by the Defias.

Ratchet exists. Of course, believing the goblins built an entire fleet of warships for the orcs(and on probably short notice) falls outside acceptable.

Exactly.

Or where do you think all the Forsaken ships in the Howling Fjord came from? -.-

Blizzard's shitty storytelling.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

Ah yes, then I suppose the Alliance has working ports in Westfall despite it having been overrun by the Defias.

The defias threat has been handled, for the most part.

But is it really your contention that if its not represented in WoW it doesn’t exist in lore?

[Yuber8900]

The defias threat has been handled, for the most part.

But is it really your contention that if its not represented in WoW it doesn’t exist in lore?

The fact that a Horde fleet was never even mentioned or given any basis whatsoever is what's annoying. We're supposed to think "they have fleets and ships but there's no evidence" just because they magically showed up? At least the Alliance has multiple ports and Westfall has a lighthouse. Then the Horde fleet whips the Alliance fleet, ugh.

Yes, I know Cycle of Hatred has loads of Orc transports, but no warships.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

The fact that a Horde fleet was never even mentioned or given any basis whatsoever is what's annoying. We're supposed to think "they have fleets and ships but there's no evidence" just because they magically showed up? At least the Alliance has multiple ports and Westfall has a lighthouse. Then the Horde fleet whips the Alliance fleet, ugh.

Yes, I know Cycle of Hatred has loads of Orc transports, but no warships.

Legends also showed a large Horde Fleet in volume 3 I believe, where Trag meets Thrall. Though they do kind of suck, since the Kvaldir essentially raped them on the west landing in Northrend.

It was the Forsaken who beat a Stormwind naval force in one battle then held off their re-enforcements through aerial bombardment. I hardly see how that is so cringe-worthy. It’s not like the Alliance had every ship at their disposal there to battle them.

So Stormwind has the new Harbor, having recently been rebuilt, and an abandoned ghost lighthouse that may or may not have been restored. I fail to see how that makes them an unstoppable naval super-power.

Also, wouldn’t the Forsaken have inherited a good deal of the naval forces Lordaeron possessed before they went undead?

[Feoremar]

What's with the extreme Tides of Darkness hate?

[Yuber8900]

At least there was evidence that the Alliance had naval power. The Horde's comes out of nowhere.

What's with the extreme Tides of Shit hate?

It ruins everything about Tides of Darkness. Rewrites the personality of every character. Completely invalidates the little man so the heroes get all the glory. The Horde isn't nearly as barbaric as it should have been. Makes the epic war that stretched across the breadth of the whole known world into a couple small skirmishes.

[Maul]

dont forget that the Horde got most of the Elven Destroyers from the Blood Elves

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

At least there was evidence that the Alliance had naval power. The Horde's comes out of nowhere.

What? An abandoned Lighthouse? A dock they just made to ease in-game travel?

Stormwind being a Naval powerhouse pretty much comes out of nowhere too, unless you factor in Kul’Tiras – which as far as we know isn’t actively contributing right now.

[Ornhelm]

At least there was evidence that the Alliance had naval power. The Horde's comes out of nowhere.



It ruins everything about Tides of Darkness. Rewrites the personality of every character. Completely invalidates the little man so the heroes get all the glory. The Horde isn't nearly as barbaric as it should have been. Makes the epic war that stretched across the breadth of the whole known world into a couple small skirmishes.

^This. The war lasted several years, not a few days. Plus there dwarves and gnomes were punted off to the sidelines, again. :mad:

[Feoremar]

It ruins everything about Tides of Darkness. Rewrites the personality of every character. Completely invalidates the little man so the heroes get all the glory. The Horde isn't nearly as barbaric as it should have been. Makes the epic war that stretched across the breadth of the whole known world into a couple small skirmishes.
Fair enough, I suppose.

I thought the characters were pretty great... but then, I never got to play the actual game, so what would I know. But I liked it.

[Yuber8900]

What? An abandoned Lighthouse? A dock they just made to ease in-game travel?

Stormwind being a Naval powerhouse pretty much comes out of nowhere too, unless you factor in Kul’Tiras – which as far as we know isn’t actively contributing right now.

ALLIANCE.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

The Forsaken defeated a fleet from Stormwind in one battle, not the entire alliance on the waters.

I don’t understand why you’re so frustrated by the Horde having some ships if that was the only time they were ever effective. They are not being depicted as kings of the seas. The Horde on the other side of the continent got the holy hell kicked out of them on the water.

[Ornhelm]

The Forsaken defeated a fleet from Stormwind in one battle, not the entire alliance on the waters.

I don’t understand why you’re so frustrated by the Horde having some ships if that was the only time they were ever effective. They are not being depicted as kings of the seas. The Horde on the other side of the continent got the holy hell kicked out of them on the water.

Stupid question: Was the Warsong fleet shipwrecked, or destroyed by the Alliance? I am lackin' tha lore, lad.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

They got ruined by Kvaldir. Basically the entire west side of Northrend got screwed and has no shipping now. They have to rely on the other side for supplies.

Meanwhile, the alliance has regular shipping to both sides.

[Kimera888]

As far as I can tell, there is no orcish "navy" per se since the end of the Second War. The orcs have a bunch of transport ships though, which are useful in amphibious operations. Some races, such as the tauren, might have an even harder time on the water.

The Forsaken are the builders and technologists of the Horde, now that the goblins are neutral; I hate the Forskaen, but they've made themselves useful. So there is a Horde navy, it's probably smaller than the entire Kul Tiras navy though.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

As far as I can tell, there is no orcish "navy" per se since the end of the Second War. The orcs have a bunch of transport ships though, which are useful in amphibious operations. Some races, such as the tauren, might have an even harder time on the water.

The Forsaken are the builders and technologists of the Horde, now that the goblins are neutral; I hate the Forskaen, but they've made themselves useful. So there is a Horde navy, it's probably smaller than the entire Kul Tiras navy though.

But Tauren make some of the best pirates out there, although us land lubbers are tougher than they thought.

HPG says the Horde does have juggernauts and troll destroyers, and that since settling in Durotar their naval power has grown.

The thing is, other than Kul’Tiras, there was no real naval superpower. We never heard much about the naval capabilities of any other human nation, and Kul’Tiras today is said to not be as powerful as it once was after all the losses they suffered. The Grand Admiral in Stormwind right now wears a Theramore tabard, so who knows how powerful the alliance is.

Though seemingly having an advantage, I don’t think the alliance should just be considered to totally dominate the Horde in terms of naval strength.

[Omacron]

Hrm. Why are the forsaken considered the technologists of the horde? Shouldn't their technology be on par with that of the humans?

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

It is, except in certain fields like biological warfare, etc. I'd say Goblins are the technologists of the Horde even though they're not official members... yet.

[Omacron]

It is, except in certain fields like biological warfare, etc. I'd say Goblins are the technologists of the Horde even though they're not official members... yet.

Yeah. Chemical engineering, I'm fine with the forsaken being the best in. But otherwise, they are, or should be, on par with humans.

[Fordragon]

A big part of technology is infrastructure. If you don't have a facility to build new battleships you can't experiment with new designs. In that sense, the Forsaken are a great deal behind.

[RobLore]

The best to worse Horde and Alliance engineers in my opinion (incl Goblins).
1. Goblins
2. Forsaken
3. Blood Elves
4. Orcs
5. Tauren
6. Trolls

Goblins are obvious. Just look at the Forsaken, they have all kinds of stuff. Remember Belf engineers from Wc3 aswell as Arcane Golems etc? Orcs have developed powerful stuff such as Demolishers.
Keep in mind that the Tauren have ELEVATORS. Trolls dont have any technology - at all :P

Alliance (incl High Elves)
1. Gnomes
2. Draenei
3. Dwarfs
4. High Elves
5. Humans
6. Night Elves

Gnomes are as obvious as Goblins. Now, Draenei are aliens and have learnt some stuff from the Naaru but they are still amazing. Dwarfs are almost equal to Gnomes. They would be just as smart if they didnt drink beer all the time >.<
Since Belfs have good technology, so must Helfs, right? Seriously, humans have brought nothing in terms of technology in the Warcraft universe >.> Perhaps the Steam Ships. But they were probably designed by Dwarfs. Same thing with Night Elves. They dont even like technology. The Glaive Thrower might be impressive thought.

Now lets see who wins.
1. Gnome VS Goblin = Gnome
2. Forsaken VS Draenei = Forsaken
3. Dwarfs VS Blood Elves = Dwarfs
4. High Elves VS Orcs = High Elves
5. Humans VS Tauren = Humans
6. Night Elves VS Trolls = Night Elves

Winner: A not suprising victory to the Alliance who won with 5 races out of 6.

Forsaken won over Draenei because Draenei have been babysitted by the Naaru and the Forsaken have come up with all their technology themself and seem to advance fast. Dwarfs win over Belfs as they have Steam Engines and Planes etc. I asume that Helfs are similar to Belfs in technology and the only thing Orcs have are Demolishers >.>
Humans wins over Tauren as the Tauren only have elevators.
Night Elves wins over Trolls because of one single thing. Glaive Throwers. The Trolls have nothing at all. Its amazing how they can get Glaive Throwers dont work. They must have been enchanted by the Druids of the Talon.

[Lon-ami]

Yuber is right, like or not. The ships of the Horde had no freaking origin, nowhere.

Those of the 2nd war were created near Grim Batol, and I suppose stolen Stormwind Harbor, but those places are no longer at Horde hands, and they had no docks at EK during the 3rd war, or they would have not stolen human ships.

Horde needs a port, and it needs it now. I imagine them building the ships east of Orgrimmar, no need of water, and then taking them to the sea using zeppelins or tunnels or whatever.

Cause Ratchet ain't making all those warships.

Also, PS: The Horde fleet must be commanded by an ogre!!

Alliance is commanded by Theramore's Jes-Tereth, and Theramore's opposite are the Stonemaul, so... you see the connection. I hope.

[Wickedpissah]

The best to worse Horde and Alliance engineers in my opinion (incl Goblins).
1. Goblins
2. Forsaken
3. Blood Elves
4. Orcs
5. Tauren
6. Trolls

Goblins are obvious. Just look at the Forsaken, they have all kinds of stuff. Remember Belf engineers from Wc3 aswell as Arcane Golems etc? Orcs have developed powerful stuff such as Demolishers.
Keep in mind that the Tauren have ELEVATORS. Trolls dont have any technology - at all :P

Alliance (incl High Elves)
1. Gnomes
2. Draenei
3. Dwarfs
4. High Elves
5. Humans
6. Night Elves

Gnomes are as obvious as Goblins. Now, Draenei are aliens and have learnt some stuff from the Naaru but they are still amazing. Dwarfs are almost equal to Gnomes. They would be just as smart if they didnt drink beer all the time >.<
Since Belfs have good technology, so must Helfs, right? Seriously, humans have brought nothing in terms of technology in the Warcraft universe >.> Perhaps the Steam Ships. But they were probably designed by Dwarfs. Same thing with Night Elves. They dont even like technology. The Glaive Thrower might be impressive thought.

Now lets see who wins.
1. Gnome VS Goblin = Gnome
2. Forsaken VS Draenei = Forsaken
3. Dwarfs VS Blood Elves = Dwarfs
4. High Elves VS Orcs = High Elves
5. Humans VS Tauren = Humans
6. Night Elves VS Trolls = Night Elves

Winner: A not suprising victory to the Alliance who won with 5 races out of 6.

Forsaken won over Draenei because Draenei have been babysitted by the Naaru and the Forsaken have come up with all their technology themself and seem to advance fast. Dwarfs win over Belfs as they have Steam Engines and Planes etc. I asume that Helfs are similar to Belfs in technology and the only thing Orcs have are Demolishers >.>
Humans wins over Tauren as the Tauren only have elevators.
Night Elves wins over Trolls because of one single thing. Glaive Throwers. The Trolls have nothing at all. Its amazing how they can get Glaive Throwers dont work. They must have been enchanted by the Druids of the Talon.

Truly...mind-boggling. Tell me, Rob, how do you get your bra and panties on in the morning? It's...remarkable!

http://www.thesocialcentre.com/images/drcox.jpg

[Zula]

Trolls dont have any technology - at all

So no technology was needed tu built their ancient massive cities... Or even to build their cities in the most awkward places, think of Zabra'jin in Zangarmarsh.



Now lets see who wins.
1. Gnome VS Goblin = Gnome
2. Forsaken VS Draenei = Forsaken
3. Dwarfs VS Blood Elves = Dwarfs
4. High Elves VS Orcs = High Elves
5. Humans VS Tauren = Humans
6. Night Elves VS Trolls = Night Elves

Well I agree with the Gnomes being superior in techonology terms over the Goblins, but the difference isn't so big. Its more about the fact gnomish technology is a bit more durable and tends to explote less. But in general terms I think they are on the same ground.

Now, Draenei are aliens and have learnt some stuff from the Naaru but they are still amazing. Dwarfs are almost equal to Gnomes.

Dranei have almost no advanced technology. The Exodar if we count it like as some technogical stuff and not more like a magical thing, wasn't built by Dranei but by the Naaru. The only real example of Dranei technology we actually see are the ruins scattered in Outland, and one or two actual towns.

Dwarfs win over Belfs as they have Steam Engines and Planes etc.

Well first of all you said before Dwarven technology was has good as Gnomish one, and you as right as you are wrong. Dwarven technology is good and reliable bt its development depends on gnomish techonology, they depend on the Gnomes to make their techonological advances. Also you forget the Blood efls don't really need steam tanks and planes, they have control over the arcane. Meaning they can blow up a tank with a simple spell.

I asume that Helfs are similar to Belfs in technology and the only thing Orcs have are Demolishers >.>

Have you ever been to Warsong Hold in Northrend? You are going to tell me the orcs are technological inferior to High elves? that fortress is practically a masive forge. What the orcs lack in lets say advanced engenireeing they compensate it with skills at metal smithing (not on par with Dwarven skills of course)

Humans wins over Tauren as the Tauren only have elevators

Only elevators? You know all the knowledge and techiniques needed to build a city like Thunder Bluff, atop a fuckning mountain? If the tauren don't display advanced engenireeing like the humans( who by the way got it from the Dwarves or Gnomes, not by their own) is because they don't consider it to be necesary.

The Trolls have nothing at all. Its amazing how they can get Glaive Throwers dont work. They must have been enchanted by the Druids of the Talon.

Once again you are talking in absolute terms, the troll have nothing? What about liquid fire? or masonry?

[Hidden]

Truly...mind-boggling. Tell me, Rob, how do you get your bra and panties on in the morning? It's...remarkable!

http://www.thesocialcentre.com/images/drcox.jpg

I love you. <3 Scrubs.

[Wickedpissah]

I love you. <3 Scrubs.

I read that post and truly understood Doctor Percival Ulysses Cox for the first time. My mind also went to Lewis Black's "Stupidest sentence I've ever heard in my life" rant.

"If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college."

[Warlock]

Since when were the Forsaken master engineers? At least the Blood Elves HAVE an Engineer unit in Frozen Throne....

Also, since this is about shipbuilding and not engineering:
http://www.wowwiki.com/Destroyer

Trolls are not last...

[RobLore]

Yay Quote wars.

So no technology was needed tu built their ancient massive cities... Or even to build their cities in the most awkward places, think of Zabra'jin in Zangarmarsh.

This wasnt how I viewed technology >.>
I was thinking about stuff like Shredders and Spider Tanks etc. Not architecture engineering.
And even then, the Trolls live in wood and leather huts. Zabra'jin can be built by climbing and some ropes. I doubt they have steam-powered stuff :P

Yeah, I admit that I was thinking a lot of the Draenei, since they have done little things on their own. However, they do build stuff like the mushroom city in Zangar. And have elevators. And the fact that they can even control Naaru technology is amazing.

I joked about that Dwarfs would be on equal levels to Gnomes if they didnt drink beer 32/9 :P
I based Helf and Belf technology on WC3: TFT.

I suspect that the new Orc buildings were designed by Goblins :P
I play Horde and if you like inside Warsong Hold, its atleast operated by Goblins.
I still think Belfs are smarter then Orcs in terms of technology.

Thunder Bluff must be downscaled, as in order to be a city there, the Taurnes only way to get up would probably a narrow path around the pillar á lá Thousand Needles.

Also Liquid fire isnt very technical to me. From what I know, Liquid fire is just a Potion that is thrown down on the enemies.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

Yuber is right, like or not. The ships of the Horde had no freaking origin, nowhere.

Those of the 2nd war were created near Grim Batol, and I suppose stolen Stormwind Harbor, but those places are no longer at Horde hands, and they had no docks at EK during the 3rd war, or they would have not stolen human ships.

Horde needs a port, and it needs it now. I imagine them building the ships east of Orgrimmar, no need of water, and then taking them to the sea using zeppelins or tunnels or whatever.

Well Lon, in the past you have complained about how wow should depict every last detail of the lore and were unwilling to accept that WoW was not an exact representation, so I expect this position from you.

Sources like the RPG, novels, and manga have shown the Horde to have developed a modest navy and to have been increasing its naval power since settling Durotar. I don’t have the book on hand, but could someone check in Legends: Volume 2 Trag story, I seem to remember them mentioning a port in Bladefist Bay or some such. There were defiantly ships off the coast by org.

They’re not going to add a port there in-game because it would be redundant for travel purposes. Maybe if we get a sea expansion, but it wouldn’t mesh thematically when all the other Horde transports are by Zep. And we know Blizz doesn’t like to do actual work, especially if its only story related.

The Forsaken would also have come into possession of all the ports owned by Western Lordaeron by inheritance.

The “no origin” thing is product of the desire to have every single detail laid out in excruciating and unnecessary detail. Its the same complaint you always say about Garrosh, “Zomg we never saw any indication of this!” RPG saying Horde has been building up its navy and Thrall saying “contact the Goblin shipwrights.” isn’t enough to explain how the Horde got additional ships. We have to see the negotiations, read the contract (including the fine print), and observe the construction process from the gathering of materials to the final launch in order for it to have actually “had an origin”.

[Fordragon]

Gurt, why do you think the ports in western Lordaeron are still functional? Every other bit of infrastructure was basically destroyed by the Scourge, why would they ignore harbors that their enemy could use as bases to build new weapons and possibly even escape them? If I were running the Scourge, razing those would be priority one.

Whatever navy the Horde has makes far more sense to be bought from shipyards on Kazan or new facilities built after the Third War, rather than shipyards that the Scourge left untouched.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

Towns still stand, windmills still function, etc. If the ports were damaged or occupied by the Scourge, the Forsaken have had years to rebuild. If the Scourge was using any of the ships, then they would have fallen to the Forsaken. They’ve had just as much time as Kul’tiras has to rebuild a fleet. The point was the locales for ports were there, and could be reused, though not represented in WoW itself.

[Fordragon]

Yeah, they stand, but look at the state they're in. And they're not even strategic targets. If a target of opportunity is in bad shape, a strategic target (like something your enemy would use to make war on you) is going to be in much worse shape. If they have shipbuilding facilities, which is very possible, they would have to be rebuilt from the ground up.

Also, Kul Tiras only lost ships; Jaina couldn't steal their shipyards like she did everything else when she tried to gut the place. They could start replacing their losses immediately, as they had intact infrastructure.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

We don't know either way. Much of Lordaeron wasn't lost in traditional warfare but through plague and conversion. If the Scourge could have occupied the Shipyards, I'm sure they would have rather done that than simply destroying them.

Either way, the Forsaken have had plenty of time to develop a decent Navy. Anyone who was a seaman (heh) beforehand still would have been, same for ship-builders, etc.

Overarching focus on taking the fight to the Lich King probably spurred on naval development, and Sylvanas was said to travel there herself on numerous occasions.

[Lon-ami]

The problem here, at least for me, is the lack of ports.

And I'm not referring to "no ports in-game", I'm referring to "no sources saying there were ports".

If there was anything anywhere saying "yeah, we build these ships" or "our docks have been busy building these ships" then I would be happy.

But they don't, and thus, appear from nowhere.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

I've already cited a few sources that say just that and describe the orcs having and building/commissioning ships.

[Maul]

Those of the 2nd war were created near Grim Batol, and I suppose stolen Stormwind Harbor, but those places are no longer at Horde hands, and they had no docks at EK during the 3rd war, or they would have not stolen human ships.

no boats were stolen because all the boats were taken to lorderon with all the people of Stormwind were on them.

anyways if the Orcish Navy does come back then it would probably serve as the main horde faction in the Maelstrom/SouthSeas/GreatSea expansion. Either that or blizzard can be creative and just let the alliance have there navy and the horde get an Air Fleet!

oh and i just did some research and the Orcish navy was completely destroyed at The Battle at Crestfall :D

[Steelhorns]

When Stormwind Harbor was announced I was hopeing Undercity would get the same treatment with a underground harbor connected to the sea via the world's largest sewer pipe.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

no boats were stolen because all the boats were taken to lorderon with all the people of Stormwind were on them.

oh and i just did some research and the Orcish navy was completely destroyed at The Battle at Crestfall :D

Lon is talking about the boats the orcs stole from the alliance to escape to Kalimdor. Must have been a lot of them to transport the entirety of the Orcs.

And it should be fairly obvious to anyone that the Horde would not have retained a functioning navy after the second war. They were captured and interned for like 20 years, how stupid would the alliance be to have let them keep up a functioning navy from inside their pens? Almost everything the Orcs have is new.

They have rebuilt their navy, and adopted naval support from new additions like Trolls, Ogres, Blood Elves, etc.

HPG says specifically that the Horde has been rebuilding their navy since settling in Durotar, and that their power is growing. It mentions troll destroyers and juggernauts.

In the comic, Thrall orders Saurfang to commission ships from the goblin shipwrights in issue 20 specifically to prepare for Northrend. In issue 17 Thrall tells Varian that he’s already begun sending some ships to Northrend.

In Warcraft Legends there is a fleet of Horde ships docked near Orgrimmar. Trag stows away on one to get to Northrend.

CoH prominently features orcs on boats. It also said Ratchet favors the orcs for resources.

[Kimera888]

Hrm. Why are the forsaken considered the technologists of the horde? Shouldn't their technology be on par with that of the humans?

A big part of technology is infrastructure. If you don't have a facility to build new battleships you can't experiment with new designs. In that sense, the Forsaken are a great deal behind.

And yet wasn't it the Forsaken that built the docks (and maybe an entire seaside town) for the Horde in Northrend?

[Fordragon]

And all that effort that went in to building baseline facilities could have been directed to new types of vessels had they already had functional facilities. Hence, why places that already had facilities, like Stormwind, are moving past sail-driven ships to steam-powered ironclads. Case in point.

[Kimera888]

And all that effort that went in to building baseline facilities could have been directed to new types of vessels had they already had functional facilities. Hence, why places that already had facilities, like Stormwind, are moving past sail-driven ships to steam-powered ironclads. Case in point.

I still think that made the Forsaken the technologists of the Horde, even if they're not great strategists. And a supply base is important, especially for those who didn't have one in the first place.

If the Horde really wants to win a naval war, they need to buy warships from the goblins. I don't see much point though; they're not going to fight the Old Gods, Scourge or Burning Legion on the water. (Well, probably not.) Building a well-armed navy would only help them fight the Alliance. I wonder if Garrosh is pressuring Thrall for more warships?

[Omacron]

Er, what about the Naga? And what if the naga are controlled by/allied with the old gods? Just with WotLK, the alliance and horde will have two opponents, the other faction and the main villain for the game.

[Kimera888]

Wouldn't you need submarines to fight the naga? I think magic is a better solution there; take a strike force, able to breathe underwater, against the naga capital. (And what does the Maelstrom do to magic?)

I want my goblin sea subs back!

[RobLore]

I expect us to see a Gnomish Submarine and a Goblin Giant Turtle under the Maelstrom :) They should function like Orgrims Hammer and the Skybreaker :)

[Orrustus]

The orcish ship that landed in Borean tundra was most likely the ships the Orcs stole in warcraft 3 to get across, it most likely took them a lot of work and most of the wood they were using to build Orgrimmar and Orcs seem to favor zeppelins more than ships.
The Horde navy on sea will mostly consist of Forsaken/Blood Elf ships fighting the Alliance that will mostly be controlled by Humans with a few of the other races mixed in.
However i think that blizzard will be putting in a lot more air fighting and the Orc will mostly be fighting abord airships with the goblins on their side against the airships that will be controlled by Dwarf/Gnomes.

[RobLore]

???
The Orcs stole human ships. The ships in Borean Tundra are unique Orc ships of the New Horde.

I wonder why the Horde sailed to Northrend in the first place when they have a huge Zeppelin network >.>
Perhaps there were lots of Frost Wyrms or something :P

[ARM3481]

I wonder why the Horde sailed to Northrend in the first place when they have a huge Zeppelin network >.>
Perhaps there were lots of Frost Wyrms or something :P

Same reason ships are still used on Earth to carry troops and equipment overseas. Some things, like artillery pieces, armored vehicles and building materials, can't really be efficiently transported by air in bulk amounts, even by the most powerful transport aircraft. If you want a thousand tanks and catapults at a battlefield across the sea while you build a fortified beachhead, ships are really the only practical way to get them there all at once in massive numbers.

[Orrustus]

Just checked garroshs landing and yeah they looks like these are orc made ships still makes you wonder what they did to the ships they sailed to kalimdor on and were not that badly damaged on landing.
Most likely used them to build their initial bases there and later on Orgrimmar.
And ARM, Garrosh and Saurfang were discussing that exact thing that they were in need of heavy machinery like catapults and shredders and Saurfang wanted to wait untill they had those things while Garrosh said just go with what we got and brute strength.

[Gurtogg_Bloodboil]

Just checked garroshs landing and yeah they looks like these are orc made ships still makes you wonder what they did to the ships they sailed to kalimdor on and were not that badly damaged on landing.
Most likely used them to build their initial bases there and later on Orgrimmar.


A lot of them crashed or were in ill repair. They probably still used the ones that worked, but its clear they have been building new ones and buying new ones from goblins.

Ashenvale is the big lumber source for the Horde, thats where they have the most visible mills and why they're pissing off the Night Elves.