Ashkandi

[Lankey]

I dont know if Ashkandi, Greatsword of the Brotherhood was ever really in Warcraft history, but I wondering what is its information. It says "the initials A.L are etched on the hilt." Who is A.L and whats his story. Or is it just a random item in WoW. Thanks for the info sorry Im a noob

[GreenEye]

A.L is Anduin Lothar, big figure in the first and second wars, was killed by an orc ambush in Warcraft 2.

[Kenzuki]

Sir Anduin Lothar was the greatest hero humanity ever had, and was the founder of the Alliance of Lordaeron.

[GreenEye]

Yeah, he was. Also the last guy in the Arathi bloodline.

[Kerrah]

And the slayer of Medihv.

[Kenzuki]

Basically if you don't know who Anduin Lothar is, you have no buisness playing Warcraft. He's like one of THE most important characters.

[Lankey]

Basically if you don't know who Anduin Lothar is, you have no buisness playing Warcraft. He's like one of THE most important characters.

Well it sucks I have his sword then :glare: I guess you cant play games just cause you like Mmorpgs these days.

[Kerrah]

Basically if you don't know who Anduin Lothar is, you have no buisness playing Warcraft. He's like one of THE most important characters.
Thats kinda cruel.

[ScytheRexx]

A.L is Anduin Lothar, big figure in the first and second wars, was killed by an orc ambush in Warcraft 2.

Technically he died in a one on one duel with Orgrim Doomhammer, not an ambush.

[Lankey]

Technically he died in a one on one duel with Orgrim Doomhammer, not an ambush.

Hey see not a total noob, didnt Ogrim Doomhammer start Ogrimmar. I think I read that in the little book that came with WoW lol

[GreenEye]

Thrall started Orgrimmar in Orgrim Doomhammers honor :)

I used the term "orc" because it's not clear wether Doomhammer intended to ambush him, or if he just went along when his comrades (thirsty for blood) charged.

And yeah, that was kinda cruel Ken :rolleyes:

[Creative]

Basically if you don't know who Anduin Lothar is, you have no buisness playing Warcraft. He's like one of THE most important characters.

For some reason, I begun to think the same about our friend Lankey here :rolleyes:

[ScytheRexx]

Thrall started Orgrimmar in Orgrim Doomhammers honor :)

I used the term "orc" because it's not clear wether Doomhammer intended to ambush him, or if he just went along when his comrades (thirsty for blood) charged.

And yeah, that was kinda cruel Ken :rolleyes:

Thing is, we don't know if the entire ambush thing still even happened, at least as far as we know. The way Blizzard explains it now, is that during the final "battle" (keyword), Anduin Lothar and Orgrim Doomhammer started to fight eachother one on one, and Orgrim came out the winner.

It could have gone the same way that Aegwynn warning King Llane went, in other words, retconned right out the window to add drama to other more important characters.

We won't know untill they explain what happened a bit better as of the new timeline.

[Lankey]

For some reason, I begun to think the same about our friend Lankey here :rolleyes:


I didnt know something about a fictional story. Sorry, didnt think it would turn out to be this big of a deal. I wont post anymore if it makes you guys feel better about youself to look down upon someone for not knowing something.

[ScytheRexx]

I didnt know something about a fictional story. Sorry, didnt think it would turn out to be this big of a deal. I wont post anymore if it makes you guys feel better about youself to look down upon someone for not knowing something.

Don't mind them much Lankey, if you want to know information about WarCraft, you can always come here and ask. I am sorry some of the guys are being mean to you, they shouldn't be, not everyone is a lore fanatic like us.

[GreenEye]

I remember thinking that the Broken Isles were Northrend once. Don't worry man, everyone has known less :) Just keep asking and reading and you'll learn alot in no-time.

[Kenzuki]

No, I didn't mean it like that! I wasn't saying it to you, I was saying it in a general sense about how some people play WoW and they think that automatically makes them "loremasters" then when you ask them about Lothar they go "Who was Lothar, what did he ever do?"

I wasn't meaning it to the OP, certainly not.

[FreeLancer]

A.L is Anduin Lothar, big figure in the first and second wars, was killed by an orc ambush in Warcraft 2.

I hate to say it, but we really can not be sure the initials A.L. are only for Lothar. It could just be the initials for some other character, perhaps the weapon designer's character, or even just his signature.

The only weapon we know Lothar had or used that was of any significance is Quel'Zaram.

[Kerrah]

The only weapon we know Lothar had or used that was of any significance is Quel'Zaram.
Blizaaaaaaaaaaarddddddddddd....
Blizaaaaaaarddddddd......

That enough for you?

[ScytheRexx]

I hate to say it, but we really can not be sure the initials A.L. are only for Lothar. It could just be the initials for some other character, perhaps the weapon designer's character, or even just his signature.

It is Lothar's sword, its just not his PERSONAL sword. Lothar was a warrior with many talents, and his personal sword was Quel'Zaram. You have to remember though, that Lothar also was the leader of the Brotherhood of the Horse, and thus its safe to say that he had a special sword crafted to represent his status in the Brotherhood.

My guess is that Ashkandi was that sword, and was the one he used whenever he was fighting for the Alliance and not on his own. My guess is that he even had the sword during the battle at Blackrock Spire, and it was somehow lost, and then found by Nefarion, who altered the sword to his own designs.

Lothar does not seem like someone that would carve his initials into a sword like it was some pocket watch, I am sure the Brotherhood did that when they gave it to him, like it was a trophy more then anything.

[Creative]

I hate to say it, but we really can not be sure the initials A.L. are only for Lothar. It could just be the initials for some other character, perhaps the weapon designer's character, or even just his signature.

The sword really belonged to Anders Loveguy!

Well, Lothar is said to use a shield aswell, so I take Quel'Zaram was a one handed sword. Lothar might aswell have had a two handed sword ((For more PvP DMG!)) to use in diffrent kinds of battles.

[Kerrah]

The sword really belonged to Anders Loveguy!

Well, Lothar is said to use a shield aswell, so I take Quel'Zaram was a one handed sword. Lothar might aswell have had a two handed sword ((For more PvP DMG!)) to use in diffrent kinds of battles.
While slaying Medihv, he used a two-hander.

[Kenzuki]

Quel'Zarem is a badass two handed greatsword, the sword impressed Medivh so much that he named it Quel'Zarem or "The High Blade" in Thalassian, as opposed to Quel'Serrar which is "high blade" in Darnassian. And it is said to be lost. Also Lothar apparantly fought with a shield at the battle of Blackrock, or at least carried it into battle. It was this shield that Turalyon picked up and used to rally the troops into battle.

Turalyon's statue is holding a broken blade, perhaps this blade was Quel'Zarem?

[Kerrah]

Blizaaaaaardddd.....
Like they are going to remember some sword if they cant remember who corrupted Sargeras.

[Ersinus]

Askhandi could also be reforged version of Quel'Zarrem. After Lothar lost it in Blakrock Spire it was found by the black dragonflight and repaired it.. This could explain why the sword has dragon figures on its hilt and still bear the initials of Lothar.

[Vicious]

Askhandi could also be reforged version of Quel'Zarrem. After Lothar lost it in Blakrock Spire it was found by the black dragonflight and repaired it.. This could explain why the sword has dragon figures on its hilt and still bear the initials of Lothar.

Somehow i don´t think it was this, good try though.

[Kenzuki]

Askhandi could also be reforged version of Quel'Zarrem. After Lothar lost it in Blakrock Spire it was found by the black dragonflight and repaired it.. This could explain why the sword has dragon figures on its hilt and still bear the initials of Lothar.

If so, they sevearly nerfed it. Quel'Zarem is so friggin' badass, it rivals the Doomhammer if not eclipse it in power.

[Kerrah]

This whole "Lothar & Swords" discussion reminded me of something; in tLG, when they are off to kill Medihv, Garona and Khadgar are given awesome runebladed claymores. They were propably very powerfully enchanted since the runes glowed "like stars" when they approached Medihv, ive always wondered what happened to those swords, Garona never used hers (she had that short sword which she could conceal perfectly).

[Kenzuki]

Who knows really. By the way, it's Medivh.

[Creative]

As Kenzuki said, the statue of Turalyon holds a broken sword, the chance of it being the shattered Quel'Zarram is high, if you ask me.
Why else would he hold a shattered sword if not to honor his dead commander?

[Smeedle]

Thing is, we don't know if the entire ambush thing still even happened, at least as far as we know. The way Blizzard explains it now, is that during the final "battle" (keyword), Anduin Lothar and Orgrim Doomhammer started to fight eachother one on one, and Orgrim came out the winner.
Related to that I found the following remark by Brann Bronzebeard in the Alliance Player's Guide on page 134 kind of funny:

"Fortunately, Sir Lothar was able to drive the Horde back to Blackrock Spire, which served as their primary base of operations. Here, he was ambushed by the forces of Orgrim Doomhammer. I’ve heard talk of Lothar losing to Doomhammer in single combat, and I don’t believe a word of it. Lothar’s sword would have rightly made mincemeat out of Doomhammer, like it did to anything else."

Looks like the author who wrote that is taking a hidden jab at Blizzard for this whole Lothar-Orgrim-Duel retconning business.

[GreenEye]

Hmm, when talking of weapons, what is the exaxt function of The Doomhammer? Do you fight with it like a regular hammer, or do you throw it? In the Mannoroth cinematic, Thrall throws it, it transforms into pure lightning on the way, hits Mannoroth's wing/armor, and then what? Can Thrall only use it like 1 time per 10 minutes, having to wait for it to "recharge" back into his hands, or does he just have to go pick it up?

[Ravenclaw2099]

Hmm, when talking of weapons, what is the exaxt function of The Doomhammer? Do you fight with it like a regular hammer, or do you throw it? In the Mannoroth cinematic, Thrall throws it, it transforms into pure lightning on the way, hits Mannoroth's wing/armor, and then what? Can Thrall only use it like 1 time per 10 minutes, having to wait for it to "recharge" back into his hands, or does he just have to go pick it up?

I'm also wondering the same thing. I think the lightning charge also had a little to do with Thrall's shamanistic abilities, which would enable the DoomHammer's power big time. There has been no record of anything epic happening when Orgrim himself wielded it, but for all we know whatever powers it may have could have been used during the assualt on the Shadow Council and later the battle at Sargeras' Tomb.

[Yuber8900]

So Grom's mad screaming axe thing is more powerful then the Doomhammer?

[Kerrah]

So Grom's mad screaming axe thing is more powerful then the Doomhammer?
Grom got an adrenaline rush, and the one thing that WoW has though us is: The only i-win-button in the world is Adrenaline Rush.

[ScytheRexx]

Related to that I found the following remark by Brann Bronzebeard in the Alliance Player's Guide on page 134 kind of funny:

"Fortunately, Sir Lothar was able to drive the Horde back to Blackrock Spire, which served as their primary base of operations. Here, he was ambushed by the forces of Orgrim Doomhammer. I’ve heard talk of Lothar losing to Doomhammer in single combat, and I don’t believe a word of it. Lothar’s sword would have rightly made mincemeat out of Doomhammer, like it did to anything else."

Looks like the author who wrote that is taking a hidden jab at Blizzard for this whole Lothar-Orgrim-Duel retconning business.

I actually think that there is some truth to both of them, I came up with a theory of the events at Blackrock Spire based on my knowledge of the battle.

My theory is based on these factors.

Turalyon seems to have some held in regret for Lothar's death, he seems to always snap at you about it when he was a unit in WarCraft 2.

One source says Lothar and Doomhammer fought in a duel, with Doomhammer pulling off the victory.

The other says that he went on a diplomatic mission and was assassniated by the Horde army.

Now here is the theory.

Lothar, Uther, Khadgar, and Turalyon were all at the final battles of the war, pushing the horde back to Blackrock Spire and surrounding them. The Alliance army gathered in the newly claimed Redridge Mountains as the location of attack. Lothar decided to go on a diplomatic mission and told the rest of the military to stay behind, Uther refused, saying such a mission was suicide, so he convinced Lothar to take Turalyon with him to watch his back.

Lothar approched the Horde frontline in Burning Steppes. The forces split and Orgrim Doomhammer stepped forward, they had a small conversation, with Doomhammer saying that honor would never allow him to ever surrender to his enemy. He challenges Lothar to a duel to the death, and only if Lothar wins would the Horde stop its rampage.

The duel ensues, but as it does the Horde slowly surround Turalyon and Lothar, Lothar asks what the meaning of this was, and Doomhammer says something to the effect of "Just in case... I don't like cowards who run from battle"

The Alliance see that Lothar and Turalyon are surrounded, so Uther, sensing an ambush, decides to be safe rather then sorry, he commands the Alliance to attack before its to late. They rush into the Burning Steppes and start battle with the Horde.

Turalyon is worried about the rest of the Alliance, dying just a few feet away as they try to fight through the Horde to the location of Lothar, he decides to go away a bit and help split the line and before he knows it he finds himself farther then he intended. Turalyon turns around to see that Lothar is about the give the finishing blow to wounded Doomhammer, but suddenly another orc approchs the back of Lothar, an orc that decided to go agienst the wishes of Doomhammer. Turalyon turns and runs to return to the back of his commander, he screams "Lothar! Look out!".

Lothar hears Turalyon and spins around, impaling the orc on his sword, he turns back around to finish Doomhammer... and gets the blade of the Doomhammer right through the plates of his armor. Doomhammer has a look of disgust on his face for killing a man in a duel because of the outside influence of foolish soldier. As Lothar begins to bleed and lose breath, in a rage he takes takes his sword and strikes the blade of the Doomhammer still impaled inside his body, it shatters both blades, leaving the Doomhammer bald and his own blade in ruins, broken in half. He then turns to a suprised Doomhammer, falls over, and cracks him over the head with the hilt of his sword, knocking Doomhammer out cold. Turalyon finally reaches Lothar only to watch his final moments of life, in his rage and regret, he picks up Lothars sheild and sword, and rallys the rest of the Alliance to defeat the now leaderless Horde.

Turalyon held the regret for the rest of his days, since if he had kept to his duty, and watched the back of Lothar like Uthar had told him, Lothar would still be alive.

Its only a theory, but I think it fits the characters. Lothar is a superior fighter compared to Doomhammer, but because of the lack of honor in others, and the desperation of Doomhammer, he was killed.

We finally learn that it really was Turalyons fault for the death of Lothar, explaining all his complaining in WarCraft 2.

The Alliance only see that Lothar is dead, and come to the conclusion that the only way such a champion could have died would be an ambush. They saw an ambush forming which is why they attacked.

Just a theory, be a good fanfic anyways.

[Yuber8900]

Nice theory, but Doomhammer only used the Doomhammer in battle.

[Kerrah]

Thats what "Blackrock spire, the movie" would be like, but i cant understand why you alliance Fanbois cant accept it that Doomhammer > Lothar.

[GreenEye]

The Doomhammer originally had a blade ontop of it. How else did he cut off Blackhands head? :)

[Kerrah]

The Doomhammer originally had a blade ontop of it. How else did he cut off Blackhands head? :)
Who said it didnt?

[Creative]

The Doomhammer originally had a blade ontop of it. How else did he cut off Blackhands head? :)

He smashed on Blackhand's hand, many times. Until every bone and was smacked into white dust, and he used his bare hands to take off his head.

...Could have happened. :rolleyes:

[GreenEye]

Except the fact that blood was dripping off the Doomhammers blade in the concept art pic :)

He might have ripped it off with his bare hands though. That'd be kinda cool.

[Creative]

He might not have had a towel close, so he might have used the blade to remove the blood :P



But still, the Doomhammer seem to change size. In some pics, it is a huge two handed, in some a one handed, and in WoW where it is just mallet.

[Kerrah]

"Alright, now stop, its Hammertime!" said doomhammer and the armies of the horde cheered as he smashed Lothars head with the doomhammer.

[Timolas]

Thats what "Blackrock spire, the movie" would be like, but i cant understand why you alliance Fanbois cant accept it that Doomhammer > Lothar.

/smack

Thats the best summary I can give you of my feelings to that. :P
I guess you Horde fangirls can't accept that Mannoroth > Grom, and etc etc etcetraaaa...

[Kerrah]

I guess you Horde fangirls can't accept that Mannoroth > Grom, and etc etc etcetraaaa...
I accept it, but Grom had his Adrenaline Rush cooldown, so he won.

[Ravenclaw2099]

I accept it, but Grom had his Adrenaline Rush cooldown, so he won.

Heh, pretty much. The blood pact bit Mannoroth in the ass at the end. Had Grom never originally drank his Blood, Mannoroth may have still been alive.

As for the Lothar/Orgrim duel, both had proven themselves on the field of battle numerous times. We just happen to know more about Lothar's background than Orgrim's so it naturally seems like Lothar was the better fighter.

[Yuber8900]

Thats what "Blackrock spire, the movie" would be like, but i cant understand why you alliance Fanbois cant accept it that Doomhammer > Lothar.

lawl

[JSpice]

A.L is Anduin Lothar, big figure in the first and second wars, was killed by an orc ambush in Warcraft 2.


thats from WC2... in WoW during a quest chain for teh Horde, it says he and Orgrim Doomhammer squared in 1vs1 mortal combat, with Doomhammer emerging as victor... shortly after... Turalyon.. picked up Lothar's Broken 1h sword(forgot name) and battle standard and led teh alliance 2 victory against teh horde and captured the Blackrock clan includin Doomhammer

[JSpice]

It is Lothar's sword, its just not his PERSONAL sword. Lothar was a warrior with many talents, and his personal sword was Quel'Zaram. You have to remember though, that Lothar also was the leader of the Brotherhood of the Horse, and thus its safe to say that he had a special sword crafted to represent his status in the Brotherhood.

My guess is that Ashkandi was that sword, and was the one he used whenever he was fighting for the Alliance and not on his own. My guess is that he even had the sword during the battle at Blackrock Spire, and it was somehow lost, and then found by Nefarion, who altered the sword to his own designs.

Lothar does not seem like someone that would carve his initials into a sword like it was some pocket watch, I am sure the Brotherhood did that when they gave it to him, like it was a trophy more then anything.


he wasnt the leader of the Brotherhood, he was a Knight Errant

[JSpice]

I accept it, but Grom had his Adrenaline Rush cooldown, so he won.


lmfao.... Grom *IS* a Rogue!!! i knew it... that clever bastard

[Timolas]

lmfao.... Grom *IS* a Rogue!!! i knew it... that clever bastard

Well he can stealth. :P (Wind Walk)

[Yuber8900]

Stop Triple Posting!