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Old 04-02-2012, 06:40 PM
Sarahmoo Sarahmoo is offline

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Footman Argentina or: How I learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Falklands

Would like to talk about something current.

Some background information first, in case you do not already know. The Falkland are a series of small islands off the eastern coast of South America with a population of about 3000 people. The islanders call themselves British and have done so for almost 200 years, yet Argentina challenges their right to be governed by the United Kingdom, claiming that they still own the place because they controlled the Falklands for about two months back in 1832. It is a ridiculous claim not only because it violates the U.N. Charter, but also because if Argentina can claim 'las Malvinas' as their own because they used to be part of the old Spanish Empire, well then I guess England must get the United States for the very same reason. The islanders have consistently rejected Argentina's advances.

I make this thread because today marks the thirtieth anniversary of the Falklands War, where Argentina's military junta ordered the invasion of the isles to stir up patriotism and distract their citizens from their own crippling economy and overt oppression. So they invaded those that rejected them. The war was a complete failure for Argentina and their actions caused the deaths of over nine-hundred people, reaffirmed the islanders' wish to remain British and caused the collapse of the Argentinean government.

But what Argentina is doing now is outrageous. Completely outrageous and foolish. They are trying to relive it all again. For the past year they've been saber-rattling and trying to stir up this old conflict again. Out of either spite, greed or selfishness, they are currently trying to impose an economic blockade by collaborating with other South American countries to refuse service to ships flying Falklands colours. An embargo that does themselves more harm than it does anyone else. They even just recently accused the U.K. of threatening nuclear war over this issue! And why are they doing these things? Oh, I don't know! Could it be that President Fernández wishes to prop up her government with a jingoistic fervor or is it about all those oil deposits surrounding the islands? Yet you don't see France or the Netherlands pepping up about a claim to the Falklands, despite them having controlled the islands for far longer than the Argentineans ever did.

This whole dispute is about self-determination. The right for people to choose for themselves who they wish to be governed by. The people there have and continue to want to remain part of the United Kingdom, for Argentina has brought nothing to the islands but war, meddling and false claims. They've made the Falklands victims of their selfish nationalism. They call Britain the colonists, but they are the ones interested in colonizing. They refuse to accept that the people of the Falklands want nothing to do with them. See, unlike Argentina, I am consistent in my support for self-determination. Be it Northern Ireland, Palestine, Tibet or the Falklands, I have and always will speak up for a human's right to choose their own fate.

So what is the casual observer to make of Argentina now trying to take with obstruction that which they could not take with neither war nor words? They need to stop this persistent endeavor of theirs. The last time they walked this path was a disaster for them. Argentina should leave well enough alone and focus on their country's own problems rather than trying to drag up the ghosts of their recent failures and past assertions. Their pointless rattling is a disservice to their war's veterans, the rights of the Falklands people and everyone's basic sense of human decency. Their actions will get them no closer to their desires and its time for them to accept reality.

Argentina, go away.

Last edited by Sarahmoo; 09-09-2013 at 11:16 AM.. Reason: necro fix
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Old 04-02-2012, 06:46 PM
Falarson Falarson is offline

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There are cases like all the land Paraguay lost the the Allies back in the 18th Century and the part given to Bolivia by US President Hayes. Nobody gives a damn about that anymore, and it's quite a lot.

http://www.uaa.edu.py/biblioteca/ima...a1938-2011.jpg

Argentina should just stfu.
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Old 04-02-2012, 06:48 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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They won't invade again. If they did then Britain would invoke article 5 and Argentina would be in the shitheap faster than they could even get their boats out to the islands in question.
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:02 PM
GenyaArikado GenyaArikado is online now

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900 hundred deaths?...pfttt, 1347 homicides were accounted last January here.


Anyway regarding to the new issue, im sure that el hijo de su putisima madre that rules us would support Cristina, considering he was one of the funders for her campaing (with state money, of course)
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:35 PM
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Falklands belongs to Britain, and the majority of people living there are British descent. They won't bode well if Argentina has it's island back.
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:35 PM
Ashendant Ashendant is offline

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This is even more stupid considering that invading Falklands would probably end up with NATO on their doorsteps
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:37 PM
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If the majority of ppl there are Argentinians then Argentina has some justification. But no, it isn't like that.
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So instead of seeing this as a continuation of an era of the 20th century that gave us so much debt and destruction and undermined our liberties and conditions today that are so dangerous, let us think that we are now moving into a new era, a new era where we are going to concentrate on liberty and freedom and property rights and peace. I believe that is the cause that we should lead and I thank you very much for being part of it.~Ron Paul
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Old 04-02-2012, 07:56 PM
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I wonder what Zula has to say about this...
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:32 PM
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Oh man, I can't wait until some crazy nutjobs start bringing in the Monroe Doctrine.
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:33 PM
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Oh man, I can't wait until some crazy nutjobs start bringing in the Monroe Doctrine.
Zombie Teddy Roosevelt appears!
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:38 PM
Mark_Romaneck Mark_Romaneck is offline

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I wonder what is Zula`s stand on all of this
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:41 PM
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Zula's wonder stand, coming this May!
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Old 04-02-2012, 08:46 PM
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Zombie Teddy Roosevelt appears!
See now I actually want to see that happen.
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Old 04-02-2012, 09:09 PM
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Oh man, I can't wait until some crazy nutjobs start bringing in the Monroe Doctrine.
As the only guy here old enough to remember the Falklands War, I recall the US being pretty hands-off during the whole thing.

Reagan let Thatcher have her way there, and did little to get in the way.

At that point, the Royal Navy was actually fairly depleted, and that war was a lot closer to being a disaster to the UK than most people realize.

These days, I'd say the British are in much better shape from a tactical naval standpoint, and should Argentina decide to go full retard, they're risking not only having their hand slapped again, but being subject to the regime change treatment.

I could actually see Obama, as anti-colonial as he is, speak out against Britain in this case; which would not only be an act of colossal stupidity, but would further sink his re-election chances.
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Old 04-02-2012, 09:25 PM
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I could actually see Obama, as anti-colonial as he is, speak out against Britain in this case; which would not only be an act of colossal stupidity, but would further sink his re-election chances.
Yeah man I could also see him eating babies and letting the ghost of Colonel Ghaddafi fuck him in the ass because he's Obama, right?
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Old 04-02-2012, 10:20 PM
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MMMMMMMMMMMMM baby.
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Old 04-02-2012, 11:01 PM
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Yeah man I could also see him eating babies and letting the ghost of Colonel Ghaddafi fuck him in the ass because he's Obama, right?
Did you actually read his book?

Or do you just presume I make this shit up?

Look into Obama's dad. Seriously. Do a little research. You'll find out why he was so eager to ship the bust of Churchill back to the U.K. when he took office.
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Old 04-02-2012, 11:05 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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Did you actually read his book?
Did you? And if so, did you read it because you were interested in what it said or because you were looking for things you can spin into anti-Obama rhetoric?

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Or do you just presume I make this shit up?
No, I presume that everything you say is a half-truth at best because you only get your information from pundits and right-wing media outlets.
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Old 04-03-2012, 04:15 AM
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Old 04-03-2012, 05:09 AM
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When I was a university officer cadet in the British army we had a defence lecture about the military co-operation between France and Britain. That was because at the time, a new deal had been signed that caused France and Britain to share military assets, related to aircraft carriers and fighter jets.

So we had a French admiral over to give us a talk. After the talk we got to ask questions, and the questions everyone wanted to ask were about the Falklands.

For example, if Argentina attacked the Falklands again, would the French send the DuGalle aircraft carrier to protect them? But the French admiral seemed amused and implied they wouldn't help beyond logistics.

When Argentina attacked the first time, NATO didn't back up Britain. I don't know why they didn't.

But the feeling I get is that Britain is the only country that cares about keeping the Falklands British. That's why there's an occasional sense of panic about them.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:05 AM
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Did you? And if so, did you read it because you were interested in what it said or because you were looking for things you can spin into anti-Obama rhetoric?



No, I presume that everything you say is a half-truth at best because you only get your information from pundits and right-wing media outlets.
Yes, I did read it, four years ago while he was still in a primary battle against Hillary. I was living in California at the time and the failure of McCain in that state was a foregone conclusion. I wanted to vote in the Democrat primary to at least have a say in the final candidate. Based on what I read, I voted Clinton.

Now, which one of us REALLY gets our information from pundits and biased media outlets? Because all you do is parrot leftist media trash.

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When I was a university officer cadet in the British army we had a defence lecture about the military co-operation between France and Britain. That was because at the time, a new deal had been signed that caused France and Britain to share military assets, related to aircraft carriers and fighter jets.

So we had a French admiral over to give us a talk. After the talk we got to ask questions, and the questions everyone wanted to ask were about the Falklands.

For example, if Argentina attacked the Falklands again, would the French send the DuGalle aircraft carrier to protect them? But the French admiral seemed amused and implied they wouldn't help beyond logistics.

When Argentina attacked the first time, NATO didn't back up Britain. I don't know why they didn't.

But the feeling I get is that Britain is the only country that cares about keeping the Falklands British. That's why there's an occasional sense of panic about them.
Yep. Britain was very much alone last time around, and likely will be again.

And, Sarahmoo, let's be realistic - Obama giving a meek endorsement of the "status quo" is hardly an enormous pledge of support for the British. Obama won't lift a finger to help defend the Falklands, and I would still not put it past him to speak out against the British interest there when the shit hits the fan.

What you hear over and over again against the British on the issue is that it would be cheaper for the British government to buy everyone in the Falklands a house anywhere else in the world and pay to re-locate them than it would be to defend the island.

But nobody seems to have a problem with the Argentinians being dicks about the whole thing and learning to just leave them the hell alone. Like I said, if they make another attempt at a takeover, what needs to happen is regime change. It's the only way to let them know that the Falklands aren't worth the trouble.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:17 AM
GenyaArikado GenyaArikado is online now

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*le gasp*

Anyway, I wonder what trouble is Cristina trying to deflect by going with OMG MALVINAS.
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Old 04-03-2012, 08:34 AM
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*le gasp*

Anyway, I wonder what trouble is Cristina trying to deflect by going with OMG MALVINAS.
It's the 30th anniversary. Something needs to be said; might as well make it a pissing contest and build a little political capital while you're at it.
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Old 04-03-2012, 09:54 AM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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Now, which one of us REALLY gets our information from pundits and biased media outlets? Because all you do is parrot leftist media trash.
I don't consume American media, nice try. Incidentally I'm not the one constantly linking to right-win websites to back up my arguments, instead using wikipedia and occasionally politifact.

The fact that Obama outright supporting British claim to the islands isn't enough to convince you that he in fact supports British claim to the islands, because you're already arrived at a pre-determined conclusion that he hates intervening in colonial hotspots because he doesn't support the European powers.

Remember the ghost of Colonel Ghaddafi I mentioned a few posts back?

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When Argentina attacked the first time, NATO didn't back up Britain. I don't know why they didn't.
Because Britain didn't want to invoke Article 5 for what appeared to be a colonial endeavour. It's far different now, and they wouldn't hesitate this time.
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Old 04-03-2012, 09:55 AM
Magistrix Verdande Magistrix Verdande is offline

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No, I presume that everything you say is a half-truth at best because you only get your information from pundits and right-wing media outlets.
This.

Also, I have a suddeny craving to watch "The Iron Lady" again. Such a fantastic movie.
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