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Old 04-14-2017, 09:12 PM
Ol'Yoggy Ol'Yoggy is offline

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Originally Posted by Aldrius View Post
I don't think you understand what nihilism is then.

Something being nihilistic does not mean that it's grim. The two words aren't even close to synonymous.

Nihilism is the idea that concepts only have power or importance because humans (well in this case sentient beings) give them power and importance not because for metaphysical reasons.

Though, to go off on a bit of a tangent, it always bothers me that it's interpreted when someone says something is 'relative' that somehow means that objectivity doesn't exist or that good and evil are meaningless concepts. Just because something being 'good' or 'bad' is relative doesn't mean constructiveness and destructiveness don't exist. It doesn't mean humanism doesn't exist.

Like, Kerrigan's whole redemption arc in WoL is basically: "The Universe says that Kerrigan will be an instrumental good guy in a big upcoming battle. If you don't try to keep her safe or if you don't like her and support her, then you suck and are wrong and are basically dooming the universe."

In that situation basically every character loses any sort of agency because the metaphysical universe at large is telling them how to feel and how to act.

HotS and LotV sort of tried to develop that a little more, but never really went very far beyond it.

I much prefer something like Grom's redemption story in WC3. Grom was a guy who was ultimately trying to do the right thing, couldn't escape his past, fell on his ass because of his own personal flaws, then when it counted he chose to do the right thing. I just find it a much more personal story. Even with all the demons and the blood addiction and whatever.

Grom's redemption story is entirely based on the fact that Grom himself WANTS to be redeemed. That he wants a better life for himself and his people. That's a more compelling/captivating motivation than the plot deciding it for him.

Kerrigan's redemption story is entirely based on the fact that other people want her to be redeemed. (And that the plot needs her to be redeemed for it to work/make sense)

Except she DID want it. She had no reason to believe Raynor would forgive her in Heart, yet she still chose to save the people of korhal. Ultimately Raynor DID get through to her and even in Heart she feels regret when she kicks the dog on Kaldir. More damningly only Raynor wanted her redeemed. With everyone else it's "we don't like you but if we don't cooperate the universe is fucked". Basically teeth clenched teamwork.

This also ties in with the fact that the Queen of blades was NOT character development but artificial change forced on her. My impression of Kerrigan was that she had an inner darkness but she was NOT a barely stable harpy. She had genuinely admirable qualities, was an idealist and even the Tarsonis thing doesn't ruin that because a.) EVERYONE in the Sons was complicit b.) Kerrigan at least felt bad about it unlike most and c.) Kerrigan not only convinced herself the protoss would kill the entire planet (they're still shrouded in mystery since biting the bullet was cut) but was acting out of misguided loyalty to a man she worshipped as a father figure. It's more of a tragedy on her part. She was NOT a bad person and her standards were there. The infestation artificially modified her personality into something else (whether by amplifying darkness within, suppressing compassion or whatever), but she did not reach where she was in BW by character development.

That's why, clunky as it was, HOTS had development. Kerrigan starts out confused. Events conspire to take what little she has left away, and she makes the decision to go to war. When she learns Raynor's alive, she starts to calm down, and after getting called out decides to, of her own volition, spare people when it's inconvenient (something most protaganists don't do in this franchise.)

Kerrigan actually EVOLVES in heart of the swarm and CHANGES as a character.

Kerrigan starts out a certain way and evolves into something different by the end. It isn't "oh, infestation brainwashes me and than randomly makes me a psychopath". You can easily claim she never really had agency in BW, since it was change that was artificially forced on her.
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Old 04-21-2017, 09:07 AM
Gurzog Gurzog is offline

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Starcraft 1 and broodwar are now free to play

I have them both from here
Btag is Hulk#23939
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