a thought: even with whatever number they picked up from outland and the val'kyr resurrections, the horde must be getting to the point where their spread too thin?

when you think, the forces that remained in outland (we haven't seen many return, rexxar, nazgrim) the forces still in northrend (Saurfang and over devisions) and with the recent debuckle of Garrosh leading his troops to certain death in the twilight highland and against the quillboar, your right, it doesn't exactly come off like many horde soldiers are surviving or remaining as a whole.
In which case it doesn't make sense, because even before cata, it was often regarded the horde's forces are less then the alliance, yet after cata they can outweigh them? Wheres the thinking in this?

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It was mostly the RPG books that said the Alliance outnumbered the Horde(by a whole lot too). With them out of the way, blizz can come up with whatever they want now.

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The Alliance took the bulk of the casualties in Northrend, if for the simple fact that the Scourge seemed to target the Alliance more than the Horde. This in combination with the Forsaken being douchenozzles as usual.

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"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies… strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night… live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II

The Forsaken killed an equal number of Horde troops at the battle of the Wrathgate. So, yes, the losses were pretty much equal on both sides.

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“Weakness and ambivalence lead to war.” - George H.W. Bush

Thrall comments in the same book that the Alliance has their wake, that the Horde lost "a generation" in Northrend.

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A dead leader's often better than a live one, a dead leader's idealized, he can't do something stupid and make people hate him.

That's in addition to the ones that they killed in Howling Fjord and the ones the Orcs killed in Icecrown.

That was Thrall being metaphorical. I sincerely doubt they literally lost an entire generation. He's talking about the psychological toll, not a literal one.

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"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies… strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night… live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II

Note the humans shot first in Howling Fjord and killed several Forsaken, and the Broken Front killed the Horde troops as well as the Alliance.

Fojar, I know your bias to anything to do with the alliance, especially thinking that the alliance could be more the victim then the horde, but purposely ignoring the horde having lost as many forces in the scourge war as the alliance isn't constructive, come on...

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We don't know who shot first, but that's beside the point. The Forsaken lost some troops but the Alliance lost a fleet.

The Broken Front costed the Alliance an army and the Horde some scouts.

I'm not. They just didn't lose as many. Arthas personally led an attack on Valgarde and sent Naxxramas against the Alliance. The closest thing the Horde can claim is that Kel'thuzad personally led the attack on Warsong Hold but that wasn't much worse than what Valiance Keep weathered.

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"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies… strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night… live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II

So Vengeance Landing alone took out a whole Alliance fleet? Impressive. I clearly need to replay this.

Though isn't the Alliance much larger in population base than the Horde anyway? The Horde consists entirely of races that were almost obliterated at one point (or technically were, in the Forsaken's case) until Cataclysm, while the Alliance's races have had continuously stable population bases, except gnomes and the clearly forgettable draenei.

Not really. Stormwind was decimated in the First War, numerous other kingdoms severely damaged in the second, and the heartland of Alliance power eradicated in the Third. The Night Elves have never had large numbers either.

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"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies… strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night… live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II

Numerous? The only one I can think of that was severely damaged was Stromgarde. Stormwind's population has clearly recovered by the time of WoW, and humans as a whole were never in danger of being rendered extinct in the first place. And night elves may have had relatively small populations, but they were quite sustainable and didn't seem to be that unduly disrupted by the Third War.

Rofl, yes they were. When Arthas returned he began hunting down human survivors. We also know that the Scourge was pushing South into Gilneas.

If the Dread Lords went along with the Scourge then the only remaining human kingdoms would be Stormwind and Kul Tiras.

That's assuming that the Scourge didn't continue to push into other nations. The Scourge and the plague were created to destroy the humans. Saying they were never in danger is bull shit.

And they have have not recovered, they still have a lot of their kingdom to rebuild. Gold shire used to be a city, now it is nothing but a small village.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Fojar Leviathon you're seriously the worst mod.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarahmoo Go back to being the worst mod in the universe.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anansi Scrolls of Lore Rule #61: Leviathon is the worst Mod.

Stromgarde was hit hard, Kul'tiras lost lots of troops and Eastern Lordaeron was hit hard by the war.

Stormwind's population has only recovered because it was the only safe haven for humanity in the Eastern Kingdoms, and hence everyone who had their home destroyed ended up there. Humanity came very close to extinction, and the entire Eastern Kingdoms would've fallen to the Scourge if not for Illidan and Kil'jaeden.

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"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies… strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night… live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II

That still doesn't come close to comparing to your planet being torn apart, your faction being decimated, and the survivors of you being thrown into internment camps with no will to fight or live.

Still I know where this debate is heading now, like always does. Clue, it begins with an L

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Oh yes, we all know that the Orcs are the true victims of the Second War, TP.

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"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies… strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night… live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II

Certainly they lost more territory and population.

Sorry but anything you have say in comparison to it always leads back to the alliance being the victims even when there shitting on orc slaves for amusement (and that did happen)

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Trolololololololol

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Fojar Leviathon you're seriously the worst mod.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarahmoo Go back to being the worst mod in the universe.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anansi Scrolls of Lore Rule #61: Leviathon is the worst Mod.

Derailing. no one's talking about victims we're talking about material loss.

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A dead leader's often better than a live one, a dead leader's idealized, he can't do something stupid and make people hate him.

Yes, some bad apples abused prisoners. Nobody is denying that. Should we tally up all the bad apples that the Orcish Horde had in comparison to those in the Alliance? I don't think you'd like that.

What the Orcs lost (due to their own fault, I might add) they made up for in Warcraft 3 and Cataclysm.

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"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies… strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night… live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II

Yes their fault. No they haven't really made it up since half a planet does not equal a whole planet.

EDIT:

Not saying they should, but again i'm just fact correcting here.

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A dead leader's often better than a live one, a dead leader's idealized, he can't do something stupid and make people hate him.

They didn't control the entirety of Draenor. It was split between them, the Draenei, and various other races such as the Arakkoa.

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"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies… strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night… live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II