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Old 11-20-2009, 01:47 PM
Lon-ami Lon-ami is offline

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Default Zul'Aman as a zone ideas

After Azjol-Nerub as a zone ideas and Barrow Deeps as a zone ideas comes the third part of the series: Zul'Aman.

I would make this zone be the starting zone for the new Horde race of the 5th expansion. Why? Text wall /start.

ZONE DESCRIPTION

The zone has pretty much the same style as the infamous instance: a woodland of tall giant trees, full of savage animals and forest trolls. In its center, we have the Lake Abasi, where Thondroril River starts. How does that fit? they could make the river flow between Ghostlands and Eastern Plaguelands, around where the portal is, and then go around Stratholme to reach the waterfall near Tirion Fordring's old home. Aside from that, via-RPG we have the Maisara Hills and the Altar of Ula'tek, the serpent goddess.

And now comes the fanfic-y part: I think Zul'Aman as a zone could be a series of small valleys surrounded by mountains, just like the one we have with the instance. Formerly, these valleys wouldn't be connected, but some could have gates or caves linking them. Aside from Zul'Aman, Tor'Watha would lead to one of these valleys, and Zul'Mashar would "go Tyr's Hand" and open a path to another.

After those, there should be 2-3 with access to the coast, and 2 totally secluded in the interior. There could be small temples for each of the forest loas (the main ones are at the capital, the instance).

But, wait, weren't the forest trolls defeated?

FACTIONS LORE

No. Please, for god's sake, don't make me remember you what happened around that cursed instance. Let's say we just destroyed the forest troll leadership. We just ruined the capital of the empire, and that doesn't mean the entire empire got destroyed. There are trolls in there yet. This zone is the Stranglethorn Vale of Zul'Aman instance.

And what could be going around? One of the valleys, the one at the southernmost part, should be corrupted by the Scourge. The blood elves should have a considerable ship presence around the cliffs and small pockets of coasts, watching the forest troll docks that produced the destroyers of the 2nd War.

The main plot could be that a new leader has arisen, and that he promises. Every single troll is full of rage and impotence after Zul'jin's death, but this new troll has the balls and the brain to retrieve back the glory of the forest trolls. Instead of an army, he's focusing on the warbands first. There could be something dark behind, involving an Old God + Loa relationship.

And this is when Torntusk and the Revantusk enter the scene, helped by the Zandalari, to stop whatever is going on.

PLOT

But the main point of this zone would be the addition of the new playable Horde race here. They would pop out from nowhere, fleeing away or teleportating from another place, like the Emerald Dream.

Although the incoming info is completely fanfic-ing, it can easily be adapted for any other race, changing some names and locations. My idea for this new race is...

Arakkoa; but not the arakkoa we know. Long ago, there was a civilization, the Apexis, that abandoned Draenor when the dark cults started to pop around. Their bodies were more magnificent, less twisted than current's. They established themselves at the Emerald Dream, where they lived in peace until now, when the Nightmare has started to move (Anzu, the Raven God, is related to the Emerald Dream).

They could have engaged the worgen or the night elves (Alliance conflict ftw) and be forced to leave their "kingdom" and come here, to Azeroth. Some would have remained behind, the warriors and everyone who could fight. So these guys land at Zul'Aman, and you start here, knocked, at the ground.

Later they meet the blood elves and the Revantusk forest trolls, and decide to ally with the Horde. They appreciate the blood elves and the place they offer them at Eversong Forest, but their society isn't fit for them, so only a couple of them establish at Silvermoon, while the others travel to Kalimdor to join the tauren at Thunder Bluff, until they are able to return home.

And that's it. The Emerald Dream thing could be changed to pretty much anything, like another plane that get merged with the ED when the Dark Portal was opened or just a connected dimension. What you wish.

Well, thanks for reading once again, and, knowing I repeat myself, I look forward your opinions .
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Metzen: They are one of the ancient races of Northrend that we haven't spoken of before... because we hadn't made them up before. (laughter)

~Main: Expansion theorycrafting, Expansions list, The Age of Nightmare, Empire of the Tides (coming soon)~
~Fan ficton: Anachronos Journey: The Timeless Heir~ ~Geography of continents series: Old Kalimdor (original), Pandaria~
~Locations as zones series: Azjol-Nerub, Barrow Deeps, Zul'Aman, Demon Hunter zone, Caverns of Time~

Last edited by Lon-ami; 11-20-2009 at 02:46 PM..
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  #2  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:54 PM
RobLore RobLore is offline

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I dont think they will make ZA a full leveling zone in this WoW.

Maybe a daily quest area at most.
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  #3  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:57 PM
Lon-ami Lon-ami is offline

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Originally Posted by RobLore View Post
I dont think they will make ZA a full leveling zone in this WoW.

Maybe a daily quest area at most.
I was speaking about a zone in the style of Lost Isles and Gilneas, not an high level zone .
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Metzen: They are one of the ancient races of Northrend that we haven't spoken of before... because we hadn't made them up before. (laughter)

~Main: Expansion theorycrafting, Expansions list, The Age of Nightmare, Empire of the Tides (coming soon)~
~Fan ficton: Anachronos Journey: The Timeless Heir~ ~Geography of continents series: Old Kalimdor (original), Pandaria~
~Locations as zones series: Azjol-Nerub, Barrow Deeps, Zul'Aman, Demon Hunter zone, Caverns of Time~
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Old 11-21-2009, 04:55 AM
Afaslizo Afaslizo is offline

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I think, the Alliance will get Arrakoa and the Horde Ogres one day
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Old 11-21-2009, 07:19 AM
Rolandius Rolandius is offline

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Originally Posted by Afaslizo View Post
I think, the Alliance will get Arrakoa and the Horde Ogres one day
Ogres seem overdue, but then again I am not sure if the lore was ever there in the past. We could have good lore now as we do have "good" arrakoa and "good" ogres (or ogre mages I think) at Ogri'la. The thing is that why would the "good" arrakoa join the Alliance when it seems they are neutral? Same thing with the ogres (or ogre mages if that is what they all are)? Their faction is neutral and it would mean making the faction Horde if they joined the Horde wouldn't it? Then again, if they do add ogres would it have to be one-headed ogres? I am not sure if Ogri'la has those kind.
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Old 11-21-2009, 08:53 AM
Lon-ami Lon-ami is offline

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A playable bird-race would give a refreshing break to the game, and it would add some non-savage look to the Horde, to compensate the "Alliance: cute & Horde: bestial" stereotype.

Think about it like this: The Apexis left Draenor long ago, now they come here and meet races they previously knew from Draenor, the orcs and the ogres, that are in the Horde.

They've completely missed their personal age of chaos, when they got corrupted, and even if they got to experience it, they knew them from the past, and know they're good guys.

And why in the 5th expansion? In my layout idea, 5th is Azshara, 4th involves loa to some point and 6th is the Emerald Dream. Apexis arakkoa would serve as a plot-bridge between the plot of the 3 expansions.

In 5th they are fleeing from their home, where they get to return during 6th. During 5th, they could fight the first attacks from the Nightmare, too.

The Alliance race would be Naga, that would focus fighting Azshara during 5th, to later get to defend Azeroth during the battle at the Emerald Dream at 6th.

Anyway, love the talk about arakkoa as a race, but no opinions on the Zul'Aman zone?
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Metzen: They are one of the ancient races of Northrend that we haven't spoken of before... because we hadn't made them up before. (laughter)

~Main: Expansion theorycrafting, Expansions list, The Age of Nightmare, Empire of the Tides (coming soon)~
~Fan ficton: Anachronos Journey: The Timeless Heir~ ~Geography of continents series: Old Kalimdor (original), Pandaria~
~Locations as zones series: Azjol-Nerub, Barrow Deeps, Zul'Aman, Demon Hunter zone, Caverns of Time~
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  #7  
Old 11-21-2009, 11:07 AM
cenkiss cenkiss is offline

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Arakkoa being in Alliance seems more sense.They may hate the orcs for destroying Draenor.

And Zulaman had to be handled better.All we get was budd redneck and harrison jones.And zuljin sitting there.They could have given a reason to attack Zulaman.Like Amani trying to attack Silvermoon and Horde going to defend blood elves.
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Old 11-21-2009, 07:52 PM
Rolandius Rolandius is offline

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Apexis? The extinct arrakoa? Ok...
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  #9  
Old 11-23-2009, 06:40 AM
Lon-ami Lon-ami is offline

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Originally Posted by cenkiss View Post
Arakkoa being in Alliance seems more sense.They may hate the orcs for destroying Draenor.
They are supposed to be old fellas, and they could hate the orcs that destroyed Draenor, not every single orc.

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Originally Posted by cenkiss View Post
And Zulaman had to be handled better.All we get was budd redneck and harrison jones.And zuljin sitting there.They could have given a reason to attack Zulaman.Like Amani trying to attack Silvermoon and Horde going to defend blood elves.
Well, "invasion!" is just a too generic theme, and I myself would prefer to have a "we land here, in this empty forest... wait, there's an army hiding in here waiting to strike" theme.

If something, WoW has proven a total failure at enemy invasions. Just look the Scourge.

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Apexis? The extinct arrakoa? Ok...
Any problem?! ¬¬

Well, yeah, they're extinct... but some cold have survived!

Since Anzu is related to the Emerald Dream, I speculated some old arakkoa were as well, and guess what, we have this civilization that disappeared so sudden. Pretty advanced guys, that one day cease to exist. Suspicious, imo.
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Metzen: They are one of the ancient races of Northrend that we haven't spoken of before... because we hadn't made them up before. (laughter)

~Main: Expansion theorycrafting, Expansions list, The Age of Nightmare, Empire of the Tides (coming soon)~
~Fan ficton: Anachronos Journey: The Timeless Heir~ ~Geography of continents series: Old Kalimdor (original), Pandaria~
~Locations as zones series: Azjol-Nerub, Barrow Deeps, Zul'Aman, Demon Hunter zone, Caverns of Time~
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Old 11-23-2009, 06:53 AM
Rolandius Rolandius is offline

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Originally Posted by Lon-ami View Post
Any problem?! ¬¬

Well, yeah, they're extinct... but some cold have survived!

Since Anzu is related to the Emerald Dream, I speculated some old arakkoa were as well, and guess what, we have this civilization that disappeared so sudden. Pretty advanced guys, that one day cease to exist. Suspicious, imo.
I thought some quests in Ogr'ila said that those creature inventions they made turned against them?

I was thinking that Blizzard would just pick the arakkoa in Shattrath City who are already "good" guys.
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Old 11-23-2009, 07:27 AM
Lon-ami Lon-ami is offline

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There's no point in adding them as they currently are known.

I'm unsure about this, but I thought I read that the arakkoa were different before, like less twisted and more magnificent.

Since these Apexis left long ago, they could have avoided the changes their brethren suffered.

And no idea about the creatures turning against them; maybe just the guardians of the monuments; but them destroying an entire civilization is pretty unlikely.
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Metzen: They are one of the ancient races of Northrend that we haven't spoken of before... because we hadn't made them up before. (laughter)

~Main: Expansion theorycrafting, Expansions list, The Age of Nightmare, Empire of the Tides (coming soon)~
~Fan ficton: Anachronos Journey: The Timeless Heir~ ~Geography of continents series: Old Kalimdor (original), Pandaria~
~Locations as zones series: Azjol-Nerub, Barrow Deeps, Zul'Aman, Demon Hunter zone, Caverns of Time~
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Old 11-23-2009, 02:50 PM
Ku'ja Ku'ja is offline

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I think it would be perfect if we were to take ZG (with Vol'jin) that would be the best idea as he would be away from Garrosh and well im not to sure he would accept Garrosh's new actions if he was to be with him like he is with Thrall.

Not to mension the Goblins could also help a Horde indipendant Goblin city in STV would be great as the Goblins of Kezan could be in conflict with the Priates also.
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Old 05-18-2012, 11:53 PM
Kir the Wizard Kir the Wizard is offline

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Aha! I've found it.

I'll just leave this here before it is forever forgotten in the depths of Faction Thread.

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Originally Posted by Kir the Wizard View Post
I've been thinking about that "Budd is driven mad by vengeful Troll spirits" concept from WotLK. And then I thought of a plan for one sweet revenge.

I see Zul'Aman as a phasable zone with two regimes: the instanced story/questing mode, and the after-questing warzone/daily mode. After completing the storyline the "instanced" zone is no longer available, but the warzone becomes accessible from land, so that you can simply walk into Zul'Aman.

The story takes place after the evens of both Zul'Aman dungeons. With their capital in ruins, the Amani Trolls and their Zandalari supporters fall back to the mainland of Zul'Aman proper, where they are caught up in another clan war, as many clans become disillusioned with the prospect of Zandalari victory and stop cooperation with the pro-Zandalari clergy. The Amani are divided into three main groups: the pro-Zandalari central and northern regions, getting reinforcements from Tor'Watha keep, the new dungeon; the chaotic warrior tribes of the western region, Horde's sphere of interests; and the Cult of Zul'jin from the eastern region. The zone is contested, with the Horde coming directly from the west and the Alliance leading an invasion from the sea and building fortifications and a cool port on the coastline. Horde members have... varied interests in the Trolls of Zul'Aman, more about that later, and the Alliance seeks to create a foothold to launch full-scale invasion on Quel'Thalas and the Forsaken. The Blood Elves are especially wary of the situation, apparently ignorant of the Horde's war and horrified at the mere possibilty of someone coming to attack Quel'Thalas again. Also, both faction seek resources, both mundane, like wood and gold, and mystic, like Amani enchantments, magical and alchemical designs.

Both Horde and Alliance have two factions of their own with interests in the region: the main and the supportive.

The main Alliance faction is Northern Offensive, headed by Highlord Leoric Von Zeldig and Vereesa Windrunner and with some darker agents like Valeera Sanguinar and the SI:7 agents. Von Zeldig concentrates his effort on seeking mineral sources, claiming mines and establishing a safe "corridor" for the Alliance forces to march west. Vereesa, on the other hand, is pretty zealous on her new position, trying to kill as much Trolls as she can. Von Zeldig warns her to not let her vengeful attitude interfere with the faster pace of their mission; and after yet another Troll village gets butchered by the Elves and a Troll tribe chooses Alliance as its main target, instead of the previous interfighting with Zandalari-aligned Trolls, the Highlord calls Vereesa out and threatens to relieve her out of duty if she continues unauthorized attacks. Vereesa yields, but instead turns to the more silent art of killing, courtesy of Valeera Sanguinar, with subtle operations like sabotage and poisoning of the water. Nevertheless, despite all odds, the Northern Offensive manages to gradually construct series of working Dwarven mines in the south-eastern Zul'Aman AND some stone castle fortifications, forcing the Trolls further to the north, where the supportive Alliance force is settled.

The supportive Alliance force is the "Nedreck Company", now expanded into a real mercenary army. These sellswords add numbers to the Offensive, to lessen the need for new recruits or taking soldiers from other fronts. Being mercenaries, they think much less of the "rules of war" and are prone to marauding and raiding Troll towns for valuables. Their overseer from the Alliance is Field Marshal Snowfall, who is tasked to control the mercenaries and to prevent any excessive acts or the company finding Horde a "better payer". To Marshal's surprise, however, Nedreck himself is pretty... angry with the Horde and seeks to force them out of Zul'Aman at all costs. He also has an anti-looting policy and is set on Von Zeldig's goal to open the Alliance a southern road to the Sacrificial Fields, a central part of zone, void of all Forest Trolls, who try to stay away from this sacred land. The strangest thing happens when Nedreck, wearing his Troll Mask, goes to communicate with the Zul'jin Cultists and, shockingly, convinces them to go further north, leaving their main temple to be decorated for the Alliance's base (think of something like Sith Massassi Temple being used by the Rebel Alliance in Star Wars). Nevertheless, the mercenary commander is very interested in acquiring Troll artifacts, especially those related to sacrificial rituals of the Loa, but Marshal Snowfall lets Budd keep these, if only as thanks for the successful mission.

Horde's main force are the Bloodslayers (name taken from a rank of Darkspear Elite, but can be relevant to both races composing the army), headed by Primal Torntusk, Vol'jin and Halduron Brightwing. After becoming brothers-in-arms during the last Amani conflict and overcoming the usual Elven-Trollish racial hatred, Halduron and Vol'jin are on friendly terms and hardly have any conflicts, although Halduron is much more focused on Horde's military goals in this zone, with the Alliance being his primarly objective. Vol'jin, on the other hand, has much grander plans, with him becoming "the new Zul'jin" and uniting all Trolls around the Darkspear Tribe with the help of the Horde. Primal Torntusk and her Revantusk Forest Trolls are brought to Zul'Aman to act as Horde's guides and loremasters, although Torntusk herself is bitter about the whole campaign and would prefer to leave the Amani alone, still sad about the fact that Zul'jin did not return to the Revantusk as promised. This force fights in the southern forests, building some lumber mills, and also persuades or even forces other Troll tribes to join the Horde's cause. Instead of constructing a new keep, like the Alliance, the Horde uses the city of one of the friendly tribes as its main settlement (something like those pyramids in the Hinterlands).

The supportive Horde force really jeopardizes Vol'jin's mission at first. It consists of Blood Elves and the Forsaken headed by Lord Sanguinar and Lady Sylvanas Windrunner herself. As one can guess, that is the "we hate Trolls" department, based in reconquered ruins of an old Elven keep. After some conflicts between Vol'jin and Sylvanas, Halduron, being the official leader of the Horde's offensive, orders Sylvanas's regiments to move north, hoping to use the more zealous part of the Blood Elves to strengthen the Zandalari front. Enraged by some mere general ordering her, the big bad Dark Lady, around, but succumbing to the Horde's military order, Sylvanas grudgingly agrees (think of something like Grand Marshal Garithos ordering Prince Kael'thas around, no racism intended). Eventually Lord Sanguinar tries to break through Tor'Watha front and stage a surprise attack at the Alliance from the north-east, but it turns out that the Alliance has been planning a parallel attack themselves. Sanguinar's army clashes with a mercenary squad led by Valeera, but in the middle of the big battle the two divisions fall before the attack of Tor'Watha Tribe from the flanks.

In all these chaotic campaigns a number of events of interest happen:

-Both pro-Zandalari and Vol'jin are trying to summon the greater Loa for help, with surprising lack of success. Apparently the great Loa support neither and are not willing to turn the tide of war for one Troll or another.

-The Cult of Zul'jin and its musings on the reincaranation of a Zul-Jin, which they describe as a legendary Troll hero, who unites both witchcraft and berseker aspects of a Troll and is meant to unite all Troll in times of need. They see our old friend Zul'jin as the latest reincarnation but are unsure on the next one. Some see that incarnation in Vol'jin, others in the prophet Zul of Zandalar, and some are clearly set on the idea of ressurecting Zul'jin in a necromantic ritual. They sense a Loa curse of epic proportions placed on Nedreck's head and try to stay away from such great magiks, although they are unsure of the nature of this curse.

-Nedreck's old team being concerned about their leader's mental health, with him suffering a perconality crisis, often being found weeping about "HIM laughing at me, sucking my soul out, killing me" at one time, and dancing like a witchdoctor at other times. They stick to him no matter what, though.

-Captured Forest Trolls being used for labour in the mines nad lumber mills. Von Zeldig mearly sees it as pragmatic use of resources, while Vol'jin introduces it as some sort of a penal colony, a correctional facility for those unwilling to fight for the Horde. Primal Torntusk is shocked by this and one of her sidequests involve using player in undercover giving freedom to some Troll workers, and giving a warrior's death to some imprisoned, maddened Dire Trolls. The Alliance equivalent is Vereesa ordering the covert assassination of Troll workers.

-The Amani civil war and the factions' "help" to ignite it. They eventually succeed, but with the Trolls fighting each other all over the centre of Zul'Aman's northern part, there is little way for either faction to march onto the enemy, except by using the Sacrificial Fields, which are for some reason inexplicably hated by Forest Trolls, despite even the lack of any sacrifices at the fields! Oh, they talk about some legend of a fiery god eating the land itself, but that's just some ridiculous old tale, eh?

-The "siblings on both sides" motif, with Sanguinar meeting Valeera and Sylvanas's confrontation with Vereesa.

-Tor'Watha, the new dungeon and the citadel of power of the new Zandalari Empire. Hosts Amani and Zandalari Troll bosses, with the new Amani high priest trying to free the mysterious creature Ula'Tek from the dark below...

-More Troll lore, as seen on the tablets of lorekeepers in Amani temples. Musings on continued wars against the Elves, the presentation of a newest version of Troll pantheon, more on Trolls' relations with Goblins, the most ancient Troll legends, their relations with the Old Gods, the Trollish "worldview" etc.

The final story event would center on both Alliance and Horde armies finally marching through the sacrificial grounds. Neither army is really eager to attack first, in fear of an arising tactial disadvantage in case the other side claims and sets an array of cannons on the giant majestic amphitheatre, with a clear overlook of the whole fields from their northernmost side. Vereesa's squad with the "Alliance player" and dual axe-wielding Budd manages to clear the amphitheatre first, only to be attacked by the wyvern-riding "Horde player" party of Vol'jin, Sylvanas and Primal Torntusk (ala Battle for Undercity). The fight starts, with both Vol'jin and Vereesa ordering their armies to press the attack through the airborn messengers. Primal Torntusk is shocked by the order and quickly leaves the fight, intent on keeping her tribe out of this - but it looks like the Forest Trolls aren't eager to fight on the sacred ground anyway... And yet, the main Horde and Alliance forces clash together, in a battle of Pelennor-level proportions, steam tanks and meat wagons firing, kodos clashing with knights, magic explosions everywhere!

Enraged by the apparent "betrayal" of the Revantusks, Vol'jin clashes with Vereesa and the player is tasked with supporting their faction in such a fateful fight, with no one noticing Budd, strangely decorated in Troll holy symbols and armed with the artifacts he gained back during Snowfall's campaign, igniting the main altar and performing a strange dance with some horrible cries in Zandali. No one pays him any interest in the middle of the fight, until Nedreck finally stops and, with a diabolic laugh, jumps from the amphitheatre to his death, but not just his, apparently...

As a human's laugh slowly transforms into that of a deranged monster, a great earthquake shakes the ground under everyone's legs. The player falls down, unconscious, as the vision darkens... And when the player rises again, they can only see, thanks to gratious phasing, why these barren fields are called sacrificial - where were once the armies of Alliance and Horde now lies the giant chasm, filled with lava, as one can still hear the screams and smell of corpses burning. The fight stops as the generals look at their dead armies in pure shock. Finally, something arises from the fiery pit of death. It is a giant, genie-like Troll spirit, looking at the group with empty eyes and a mad grin. An evil laugh shakens the scene as the greater Loa finally appear above the Gehenna of the Sacrificial Fields. The Loa speak of great amusement that the mortals brought to them in their ignorance, and congratulate the spirit that masterfully orchestrated all of it. Enjoying the scene of the mortals' defeat, the Troll gods gladly accept the wonderful sacrifice, and declare the triumphant spirit the new Loa of Vengeance... Zul'jin!
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Originally Posted by Kir the Wizard View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeus View Post
Extremely well thought out and definitely something I'd love to see. Its a bit of a shame that he doesn't end up Horde but at this point that ships sailed. At least we get a compelling villain.
Oh, thank you, thank you! : )
I would also love him to be Horde right from the start, but, yes, unfortunately that hardly seems possible now.

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Originally Posted by Zeus View Post
A few critiques:

- Vareesa has a staunch hatred of Blood Elves (Night of the dragon showed it pretty clearly) so I'm not sure she'd be particularly happy to work with Valeera, at least not without some exposition.
I was thinking about it too, but I guess her cooperation with Halduron kinda showed that she can put that hatred aside for a chance to kill more Trolls for Quel'Thalas. I mean, she was pretty happy to cooperate, with Lor'themar surprisingly playing "the guy against alliances with the enemy". And I've chosen Valeera mostly because I couldn't find any other prominent Alliance-affiliated Thalassian rogue.

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Originally Posted by Zeus View Post
- Lord Sanguinar was pretty dead last we saw him, in fact he died twice. If he's coming back that's yet more exposition.
My low point, yes. Guess I just had "The Rule of Still Alive" so deadly set in my head that I forgot that this is bad writing. Reallly, I forgot about his "double-death" the moment I've seen him and thought "Ohoho, that's Valeera's theoretical brother! And he is an evil-ish guy! And he is from Sunfury, who returned to Quel'Thalas!"

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Originally Posted by Zeus View Post
- Who survives the ending massacre? I'm going to assume the notable npcs do: If so. What does Torntusk do?
The notable npcs do. Valeera comes back and Von Zeldig returns to the plan of steady expansion of the infrastructure, operations in the north, and expansion around the chasm. Enter the daily questing!

Torntusk and the Forest Trolls survive the "sacrifice" and meet with the apalled Vol'jin. The Shadow Hunter apologizes for his ignorance to her warnings, but Torntusk only says that she could hardly fight fate if the great Loa themselves approved Zul'jin's revenge. Torntusk says, that even though Zul'jin has always been a hero for the Revantusk, and even though he deemed the Horde as the greatest traitors of Trollkind, she and her mate still see the future of their tribe in cooperation with the Horde and will help to made this brighter future come true. Torntusk agrees to help with the further recruitment of the Amani into the Horde, but still warns Vol'jin that megalomanic ambitions or forcing others into obedience never go well with the Loa - like Zul'jin and Malacrassed suffered a grim fate after trying to still Loa powers for their champions, like Ice Trolls saw their empire crumbled after they betrayed their own gods, like Hakkar's priests suffered twice after their failed attempts at world-conquest and their later subduing of the vengeful Blood God, like Zandalari will eventually be let to failure by their pride. Vol'jin bitterly asks if there is any reason to fight for the greatness of Trollkind if Loa themselves play such dark tricks on their worshippers, but Torntusk only comforts him with the saying that the gods only help those who never give up, and if Vol'jin wants the Trolls to finally live in peace, he must first show the fighter's spirit worthy of a better end: Earn Your Happy Ending.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeus View Post
- Letting the vast majority of Zul'jins possession of Budd be seen only from Alliance eyes seems somewhat lame considering he's a Horde icon. I would make Redneck company neutral and focus on Zeldig and the High Elves for the Alliance. It might even make for a more shocking ending with Budd appearing out of nowhere amidst the battle. it would also connect both sides to the resolution somewhat better.
Actually, yes, you are probably right. I was thinking about some events with Budd when the Horde sends players to investigate the Zul'jin Cult, but your vision makes much more sense. Oh, I can see it now! Let Budd and the team remain neutral treasure hunters, oh so much hated by the players, seen by some as another "joke quest run", except, of cource, for those really strange quests with Budd communicating with the Zul'jin Cult and having an unhealthy interest in Troll artifacts... And then - BAM! Budd was the centerpiece all along!

Although I still want him to be the one pulling the strings behind the factions. Perhaps organizing the inter-Troll front in the north, and selling both Horde and Alliance leaders maps and battle plans through the player? Though that when both parties come to the fields they get a reaction like "Hey! I thought this was our secret route to the enemy camp! How did they arrived first to this valley-hidden fortification?"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeus View Post
- I love the melting pot you've thrown together here but some of the characters feel a bit tacked on. Sylvanas and really the Forsaken warmachine in general probably has better things to do with their forces (and as a meta reason, probably has too much spotlight already). Nixing them and making the Nedrecks neutral would probably give the story a fair bit more focus.
The Forsaken I brought up mostly when thinking about Tranquillien characters and the Dark Rangers. I'd like to explore the theme of Forsaken being not just Lordaeronians, but undead from countries like Dalaran and Quel'Thalas too... Yes, with all the possible musings about the true heirs and survivors! When there is a High Elf and a Blood Elf snickering about who's the True Elf, there is always an undead one calmly sitting at his Dark Lady's throne.

Another thing is Sylvanas Windrunner. I personally think that helping her true homeland and her real people brought out the best in her character, even melted "the ice lady" style a little in TBC. She also sees Quel'Thalas as her direct sphere of interests, as seen in Lor'Themar's story, and is cautious of both the Horde proper, personalized by Zul'jin, trying to have a more direct control of the Elves, as opposed to using Sylvanas as the main link. Finally, I'm still eager for Vereesa having a confrontation with Sylvanas. Oh, the unexplored feelings of seeing her sister like that! And with Sylvanas's apparent support of the Blood Elves, instead of the blue-eyed brethern...
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