Scrolls of Lore Forums  

Go Back   Scrolls of Lore Forums > WarCraft Discussion > WarCraft Lore Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #201  
Old 03-12-2018, 03:34 AM
Lord Grimtale Lord Grimtale is offline

Elune
Lord Grimtale's Avatar
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The Slaughtered Lamb
Posts: 22,046
BattleTag: Grimtale67#1407

Lumber (War3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mungo View Post
Found this on reddit:



Preview source here: https://imgur.com/a/1JDsG

Blizzard now seems to eliminating any shades of grey their characters have and is now fully embracing the horde=evil aesthetic. I don't play horde to be baby-munching evil.
Sylvanas has never been grey, but I can see the greyness in wanting to invade Ashenvale when the Horde were starving for resources. The problem is that even though the Horde may have needed Ashenvale's lumber they still went about it in a pretty brutal and heinous manner. It was pretty jarring to go to Silverwind Refuge and see a bunch of dead Night Elf corpses that used to be just simple vendors and innkeepers, no real military combatants at all, and then later get preached by Garrosh about how the Horde should care about sparing innocent lives. I still remember back in Cataclysm how people just accepted Garrosh after his speech and thought he would become a good guy, but it still just felt really out of place and odd to me, and was never addressed later on.
Reply With Quote
  #202  
Old 03-12-2018, 04:14 AM
Noitora Noitora is offline

Elune
Noitora's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 34,686
BattleTag: Chillman#1339

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ethenil View Post
Not quite. I think the Firelands were invaded by champions of both factions, led by the Cenarion Circle. Remember Malfurion and stuff. As for the Hour of Twilight, I think Dalaran probably had a huge involvement.

Also, Noitora, this has all been discussed in the discord. You should be there.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
Yeah but where would this forum be if not for people speculating endlessly about things Blizzard doesn't give a shit about
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathon View Post
SoL: 20 something know it alls telling other 20 something know it alls they know everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobebyarlant View Post
All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.
Reply With Quote
  #203  
Old 03-12-2018, 06:28 AM
TerrorhoofMayo TerrorhoofMayo is offline

Arch-Druid
TerrorhoofMayo's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,078
BattleTag: CJFurious#1908

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
Sure it is. The Undead up until WoW (where they showed they are enemies of the living who don't allow them to plague wherever they can) have shown themselves to be enemies of the living. Thrall wouldn't have much of a case to assume otherwise for the Forsaken. Especially since Necromancy is Demon Horde magic that he banned.
Still irrelevant. The Forsaken being undead is no indication on how they will operate in battle, several years after TFT.
Quote:
There were Dreadlords in the army. And assuming the Forsaken did the worst wouldn't be odd.
So what? There being one dreadlord among the Forsaken doesn't mean the Alliance or Horde knew what happened to Garithos. They aren't mind readers.
Quote:
Show don't tell. And there wasn't much of a case for Thrall's Horde to be noticeably more accepting of Undead until the Forsaken were shoehorned in.
Show you what? The lore is established and couldn't get clearer than that.
Quote:
That Humans live in.
Human lands. Anything more than that is your conjecture. Thrall had no problem working with humans in WC3, and Forsaken joining the Horde doesn't require Thrall to move back to EK. Human lands, not humanity.
Reply With Quote
  #204  
Old 03-12-2018, 08:14 AM
Mungo Mungo is offline

Hippogryph
Mungo's Avatar
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 185

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Grimtale View Post
Sylvanas has never been grey, but I can see the greyness in wanting to invade Ashenvale when the Horde were starving for resources. The problem is that even though the Horde may have needed Ashenvale's lumber they still went about it in a pretty brutal and heinous manner. It was pretty jarring to go to Silverwind Refuge and see a bunch of dead Night Elf corpses that used to be just simple vendors and innkeepers, no real military combatants at all, and then later get preached by Garrosh about how the Horde should care about sparing innocent lives. I still remember back in Cataclysm how people just accepted Garrosh after his speech and thought he would become a good guy, but it still just felt really out of place and odd to me, and was never addressed later on.
Yeah, grey was the wrong word to use for Sylvanas. I guess these changes really don't matter that much. It's just that they've retconned away Garrosh's few shreds of decency to make him orc hitler from the beginning.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
If it took you this long to realize that Horde is shit then yes you do
Oh, I've known both factions are terribly written for years, that's why all my characters are deranged murder-hobos who realized nothing they do matters, so they just sell their services to the highest bidder for sweet loot.

It just seems the way Blizzard is writing the horde, by the next Harvest Festival one of the dishes will be human babies and a tauren will remark "Mmm, delicious babies!" and you will pass babies around the table.
Reply With Quote
  #205  
Old 03-12-2018, 09:07 AM
Noitora Noitora is offline

Elune
Noitora's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 34,686
BattleTag: Chillman#1339

Default

If you only see Horde aggression as evil, then sure just about everyone is evil. It's weird because I see players lament over Garrosh and Sylvanas, but still defend their actions when it's against the Alliance.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
Yeah but where would this forum be if not for people speculating endlessly about things Blizzard doesn't give a shit about
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathon View Post
SoL: 20 something know it alls telling other 20 something know it alls they know everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobebyarlant View Post
All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.
Reply With Quote
  #206  
Old 03-12-2018, 04:15 PM
Ganishka Ganishka is offline

Elune
Ganishka's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Richland, WA
Posts: 8,297
BattleTag: Ganishka #1520

Default

I loathe that the Horde is getting the shaft in writing. Again. When will the Horde ever get to be portrayed as heroes, like in Vanilla?

We need Thrall as Warchief again. He was the only leader who wasn't full-on batshit.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth Baras
A blind, deaf, comatose, lobotomy patient could feel MY ANGER!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowordfun
The next time you feel like you're about to be triggered, put the barrel in your mouth.

Last edited by Ganishka; 03-12-2018 at 05:01 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #207  
Old 03-12-2018, 04:36 PM
Cacofonix Cacofonix is offline

Ranger
Cacofonix's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 300

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
Still irrelevant. The Forsaken being undead is no indication on how they will operate in battle, several years after TFT.
Meanwhile the Forsaken went to war against the non-Undead in the East who weren't Argent Crusaders back in Vanilla. Complete with later topping it off with some plague.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
So what? There being one dreadlord among the Forsaken doesn't mean the Alliance or Horde knew what happened to Garithos. They aren't mind readers.
The army I was speaking of was that of the Drealord Trio's that Garithos's army fought before he got enthralled. And Sylvanas letting a Dreadlord (servants of Sargeras who are masters of treachery) into her ranks and by inclusion the Horde's is hardly a point for her.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
Show you what? The lore is established and couldn't get clearer than that.
Show a single sign that the Horde would be more accepting of Undead than the Alliance in Warcraft 3 and its connected Expanded Universe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
Human lands.
He wasn't enthusiastic about running into Humans in Kalimdor either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
Anything more than that is your conjecture.
I don't see any signs Thrall planned to engage in geopolitical warfare against the Alliance back in WC3 once he reached Kalimdor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
Thrall had no problem working with humans in WC3
To prevent the apocalypse and not be killed by Father Proudmoore. Doesn't mean he's opening a Human Fanclub or something.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
and Forsaken joining the Horde doesn't require Thrall to move back to EK.
No but it apparently escalates hostilities between his Horde and the Alliance of Stormwind. Obviously Thrall knew this according to WoW so Thrall's apparently all about that geopolitical warfare.

Last edited by Cacofonix; 03-12-2018 at 04:38 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #208  
Old 03-12-2018, 05:21 PM
TerrorhoofMayo TerrorhoofMayo is offline

Arch-Druid
TerrorhoofMayo's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,078
BattleTag: CJFurious#1908

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
Meanwhile the Forsaken went to war against the non-Undead in the East who weren't Argent Crusaders back in Vanilla. Complete with later topping it off with some plague.
It's been a while for me so you are gonna have to provide examples.
Quote:
The army I was speaking of was that of the Drealord Trio's that Garithos's army fought before he got enthralled. And Sylvanas letting a Dreadlord (servants of Sargeras who are masters of treachery) into her ranks and by inclusion the Horde's is hardly a point for her.
All that occurred prior to the Forsaken joining the Horde, and still doesn't mean anyone could have know about it. There is also no concrete indication that other people knew about Varimathras up until Wrathgate.
Quote:
Show a single sign that the Horde would be more accepting of Undead than the Alliance in Warcraft 3 and its connected Expanded Universe.
I don't have to. The lore behind it, common knowledge these days, does enough with its explanation.

If you have a problem with that, well, that's your problem.
Quote:
He wasn't enthusiastic about running into Humans in Kalimdor either.

I don't see any signs Thrall planned to engage in geopolitical warfare against the Alliance back in WC3 once he reached Kalimdor.

To prevent the apocalypse and not be killed by Father Proudmoore. Doesn't mean he's opening a Human Fanclub or something.

No but it apparently escalates hostilities between his Horde and the Alliance of Stormwind. Obviously Thrall knew this according to WoW so Thrall's apparently all about that geopolitical warfare.
He wasn't thrilled about having to fight humans, and was happy to put it behind him by leaving human lands. Him wanting nothing to do with humanity is your own interpretation.
Reply With Quote
  #209  
Old 03-12-2018, 08:07 PM
Gurzog Gurzog is offline

Banished
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 14,056
BattleTag: Hulk#2393

Default

Chad horde crush puny alliance grug smash puny alliance.
Reply With Quote
  #210  
Old 03-13-2018, 02:07 AM
Marthen Marthen is offline

Eternal
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 4,972

Default

Having read the whole text, I do not get what are some of you moaning about in regards to Garrosh and Sylvanas.

Garrosh wanting to invade Ashenvale for its resources and not caring about diplomacy and trade has been canon since the events of the Warcraft comic. And even the beginning of The Shattering has him all "Diplomacy? Bah, we should take what we need through strength, that's the true orcish way" when the subject of Ashenvale and its wood is brought up. To Cairne's dismay. There's literally no change there.

As for Sylvanas, we are speaking of a character who built literal death camps in Hillsbrad and blighted a whole country out of spite, wanting to also invade Gilneas out of legitimate strategic reasons changes nothing about her character. And I do not remember any implication of her being opposed to the idea. Yes, Garrosh ordered her to invade Gilneas, but Chronicle does not change that, it just says she supports the order out of her own reasons.
Reply With Quote
  #211  
Old 03-13-2018, 11:17 AM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is offline

Loremaster
ARM3481's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,542

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
There is also no concrete indication that other people knew about Varimathras up until Wrathgate.
Nothing whatsoever suggested he was hidden either. However, what did exist was him demonstrably and openly handing out quests at Sylvanas' side as her majordomo and lieutenant and not hiding who he was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marthen View Post
Yes, Garrosh ordered her to invade Gilneas, but Chronicle does not change that, it just says she supports the order out of her own reasons.
Plus Curse of the Worgen had her already chasing the Scythe of Elune and aware of what it could be used for when it was smuggled into Gilneas, so she had her own reasons for wanting to get in there pretty early.

In fact enslaving the worgen with the Scythe could arguably be considered contrary to Garrosh's wishes, since even beyond his distaste for the val'kyr in particular he was generally suspicious of her desire to increase the size of her own forces.
Reply With Quote
  #212  
Old 03-13-2018, 11:56 AM
GenyaArikado GenyaArikado is offline

Banished
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 13,294

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
Show a single sign that the Horde would be more accepting of Undead than the Alliance in Warcraft 3 and its connected Expanded Universe.
you know, even ignoring that demons and undead were originally horde creatures in the older games, the horde also had the whole "talk-with-dead-spirits" thing going in all the WC3 member races, while the alliance had "holy light that smites undead"
Reply With Quote
  #213  
Old 03-13-2018, 04:21 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

Elune
Fojar's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Toronto, Lordaeron
Posts: 17,442

Default

Marthen we know you have the book post the spoilers fucker
__________________
"Noble countrymen, evil is upon us. Darkness has befallen our shores. Rise and slay thy enemies� strike, strike so others shall live. The meek shall not fade into the night� live my brethren, live." - King Terenas Menethil II
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaronGrackle View Post
You are right Fojar.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pajamasalad View Post
You are right Fojar.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbraid View Post
You are right Fojar.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
You are right Fojar.
Reply With Quote
  #214  
Old 03-14-2018, 04:06 PM
Cacofonix Cacofonix is offline

Ranger
Cacofonix's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 300

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
It's been a while for me so you are gonna have to provide examples.
Go look up Hillsbrad's camps. These aren't Argent Crusade troops by the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
All that occurred prior to the Forsaken joining the Horde, and still doesn't mean anyone could have know about it.
So what, they all figured Garithos' army went on vacation to Draenor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
There is also no concrete indication that other people knew about Varimathras up until Wrathgate.
He didn't bother to put up a disguise. And Sylvanas got no actual penalties for both harboring a Dreadlord and cooking Undead Plague.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
I don't have to. The lore behind it, common knowledge these days, does enough with its explanation.
What is this, MMO Champion? You're trying too hard to excuse Blizzard's lazy worldbuilding driven by game design issues.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
He wasn't thrilled about having to fight humans, and was happy to put it behind him by leaving human lands. Him wanting nothing to do with humanity is your own interpretation.
Meanwhile he allowed a zombie army that would escalate hostilities with the Alliance into the Horde.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marthen
Having read the whole text, I do not get what are some of you moaning about in regards to Garrosh and Sylvanas.

Garrosh wanting to invade Ashenvale for its resources and not caring about diplomacy and trade has been canon since the events of the Warcraft comic. And even the beginning of The Shattering has him all "Diplomacy? Bah, we should take what we need through strength, that's the true orcish way" when the subject of Ashenvale and its wood is brought up. To Cairne's dismay. There's literally no change there.

As for Sylvanas, we are speaking of a character who built literal death camps in Hillsbrad and blighted a whole country out of spite, wanting to also invade Gilneas out of legitimate strategic reasons changes nothing about her character. And I do not remember any implication of her being opposed to the idea. Yes, Garrosh ordered her to invade Gilneas, but Chronicle does not change that, it just says she supports the order out of her own reasons.
Horde players can't cope with their Villain Sue faction being sometimes acknowledged as the villain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GenyaArikado
you know, even ignoring that demons and undead were originally horde creatures in the older games, the horde also had the whole "talk-with-dead-spirits" thing going in all the WC3 member races, while the alliance had "holy light that smites undead"
There's a line between talking to the dead who've moved on and don't harass the not-dead and revenants who build Anti-Human camps while yelling about death to the living.

Last edited by Cacofonix; 03-14-2018 at 04:09 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #215  
Old 03-14-2018, 05:35 PM
Patrick_C Patrick_C is offline

Chimaera
Patrick_C's Avatar
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 251

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
The Horde is badly written since they have to somehow be ultra hardcore metal conquerers who are also innocent noble savages and outcasts that the mean Alliance is keeping down.
Yeah, that's the problem with Horde writing. Blizzard is constantly flip-flopping about what they are, if not in the Lore itself, then in the way they are aesthetically and thematically presented. They want both Grom and Thrall/Cairne.

This is, in fact, the reason for the constant shifts in the Warchief position. Every now and then the Horde needs a scapegoat on which to pour its faults and crimes and to be sacrificed in order to regain the "shamanistic" overtone. Said "shamanistic" WC then needs to be replaced by a conqueror when the cycle needs to begin anew. And this goes as far back as Blackhand and Orgrim Doomhammer.

The worst thing is, this simply won't the go away, because as long as we're talking an MMO, the cycle needs to go on. One way to break it would be to avoid the "scapegoating" and either make the whole Horde pay for the latest war or make them win and vindicate the conqueror Warchief, but that would mean abandoning the faction system altogether, because one of the two would have to be broken or neutered.

The other way to break the cycle would be to set the Horde down as the "shamanistic noble savages" definitely, and that is theoretically possible. However, Blizzard is too fond of the All-out Faction War™ and Edgy Death Metal Horde™ to go down that rote. Moreover, I feel a sizable number of Horde players wouldn't feel the elusive "faction pride" in a Horde that is not kicking ass and taking names constantly.

Last edited by Patrick_C; 03-14-2018 at 05:46 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #216  
Old 03-14-2018, 05:42 PM
Krainz Krainz is offline

Troubadour
Krainz's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Brazil
Posts: 2,458
BattleTag: Krainz#1972

Default

What point is this Cacofonix guy trying to make, again?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #217  
Old 03-14-2018, 06:36 PM
SmokeBlader SmokeBlader is offline

Elune
SmokeBlader's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 30,980

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
Horde players can't cope with their Villain Sue faction being sometimes acknowledged as the villain.
You can't be a villain when a faction leader, like Tyrande, compares you with a monster queen and marginalizes you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
There's a line between talking to the dead who've moved on and don't harass the not-dead and revenants who build Anti-Human camps while yelling about death to the living.
This after the human leader waltzed into their capital and declared war.
Reply With Quote
  #218  
Old 03-14-2018, 10:12 PM
TerrorhoofMayo TerrorhoofMayo is offline

Arch-Druid
TerrorhoofMayo's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,078
BattleTag: CJFurious#1908

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
Go look up Hillsbrad's camps. These aren't Argent Crusade troops by the way.
No. Your claim, your research. Don't try to come at me with bullshit about what the Forsaken did in WoW when the question is whether or not the Horde knew of their battlefield tactics prior to WoW. So either find me how the Horde would know how the Forsaken would operate in a war several years in the future, or fuck off.
Quote:
So what, they all figured Garithos' army went on vacation to Draenor?
Or they just don't know what happened to him and his crew. It's not like their deaths was on broadcast for the whole world to see.
Quote:
He didn't bother to put up a disguise. And Sylvanas got no actual penalties for both harboring a Dreadlord and cooking Undead Plague.
He doesn't need a disguise for other people to not know he was there. ffs man, Thrall and the other Horde leaders are a continent away. They aren't going to know who is standing next to Sylvanas, or who is on her payroll. After Wrathgate Sylvanas could have played it like he worked in secret with Putress against her.

You bringing up Sylvanas getting penalties shows your bias.
Quote:
What is this, MMO Champion? You're trying too hard to excuse Blizzard's lazy worldbuilding driven by game design issues.
Nah man. The lore clearly stated why and how the Forsaken got in the Horde. This has been set up since TFT, and is not in anyway some game design limitation. Blizzard fully intended for the Forsaken to join the Horde.

Second, you are not better for posting here. Dog on MMO-C all you want, I've seen better posters than you there.

Don't be mad because Blizzard didn't do it your way. I mean yeah, most people on this forum have issues with how Blizzard writes their story, me included. We, most of us at least, just don't act like our way is the only way.
Quote:
Meanwhile he allowed a zombie army that would escalate hostilities with the Alliance into the Horde.
So you want to move goalposts since you can't prove Thrall wanted nothing to do with humanity?
Quote:
Horde players can't cope with their Villain Sue faction being sometimes acknowledged as the villain.
lol what is this, MMO-C? /s
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARM3481 View Post
Nothing whatsoever suggested he was hidden either. However, what did exist was him demonstrably and openly handing out quests at Sylvanas' side as her majordomo and lieutenant and not hiding who he was.
The first part is very true. In fact I am very sure the higher leadership among the Forsaken knew of his existence. That doesn't mean Thrall and the other Horde leaders knew, and there really isn't any lore that states otherwise. The way faction leaders exists in the game makes it seem like anybody can just walk up to them and get a quest, when in reality that's probably not a likely occurrence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krainz View Post
What point is this Cacofonix guy trying to make, again?
I don't know. Dude reminds me of Galdus.

Last edited by TerrorhoofMayo; 03-15-2018 at 10:36 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #219  
Old 03-14-2018, 10:54 PM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is offline

Loremaster
ARM3481's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,542

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
The first part is very true. In fact I am very sure the higher leadership among the Forsaken knew of his existence. That doesn't mean Thrall and the other Horde leaders knew, and there really isn't any lore that states otherwise. The way faction leaders exists in the game makes it seem like anybody can just walk up to them and get a quest, when in reality that's probably not a likely occurrence.
Actually, per the events of the Battle for the Undercity...

Quest:A Life Without Regret

Quote:
But this betrayal by Varimathras and Putress... All that we have worked for is for nothing.
Thrall speaks of them both betraying the Horde. Varimathras' actions wouldn't be considered betrayal if he weren't known to be in the Horde to begin with. Rather, he would seem to Thrall like just some powerful demon who managed to get into the Undercity somehow.

Moreover, in Orgrimmar when he tells Jaina what's happened he refers to Varimathras familiarly as he would someone they both know of, rather than "a demon named Varimathras" as one logically would if he were talking about some demon who was suddenly and unexpectedly present in the Undercity.

Last edited by ARM3481; 03-14-2018 at 10:56 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #220  
Old 03-15-2018, 07:29 PM
Krainz Krainz is offline

Troubadour
Krainz's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Brazil
Posts: 2,458
BattleTag: Krainz#1972

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ARM3481 View Post
Actually, per the events of the Battle for the Undercity...

Quest:A Life Without Regret



Thrall speaks of them both betraying the Horde. Varimathras' actions wouldn't be considered betrayal if he weren't known to be in the Horde to begin with. Rather, he would seem to Thrall like just some powerful demon who managed to get into the Undercity somehow.

Moreover, in Orgrimmar when he tells Jaina what's happened he refers to Varimathras familiarly as he would someone they both know of, rather than "a demon named Varimathras" as one logically would if he were talking about some demon who was suddenly and unexpectedly present in the Undercity.
That makes Thrall an idiot for trusting a goddamn dreadlord.

I believe I don't have to repeat my previous wall of text that screams how dumb that lore development is, and also how big of a missed opportunity it is to not address that properly in Chronicle.

I was hoping Chronicle would fix the idiocy imposed on the characters during the WoW period...
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #221  
Old 03-16-2018, 12:01 PM
Kyalin V. Raintree Kyalin V. Raintree is offline

Priestess of the Moon
Kyalin V. Raintree's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 573

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krainz View Post
I was hoping Chronicle would fix the idiocy imposed on the characters during the WoW period...
I admit that I haven't paid too much attention to the Chronicles 3 discussion, but most of what I've heard suggests that they're trying to harmonize previously presented lore with their current vision, regardless of whether the fanbase actually agrees that the current vision is the best direction for the franchise.

To an extent, some of that is going to be necessary I guess, but I don't think you should expect good sense out of this thing.

But... again, that's just my initial impression.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #222  
Old 03-16-2018, 03:16 PM
GenyaArikado GenyaArikado is offline

Banished
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 13,294

Default

Varimathras wasn't a secret lol. And yes, everyone was an idiot for trusting him but to be fair, that might be part of his powers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
There's a line between talking to the dead who've moved on and don't harass the not-dead and revenants who build Anti-Human camps while yelling about death to the living.
Again, it's closer than what the holy light and human kingdoms gave us back then and you just asked for a sign
Reply With Quote
  #223  
Old 03-16-2018, 04:38 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

Elune
Noitora's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 34,686
BattleTag: Chillman#1339

Default

Sylvanas thought she had him under control, and the Horde trusted Sylvanas. For all we know she was the equivalent of a warlock.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
Yeah but where would this forum be if not for people speculating endlessly about things Blizzard doesn't give a shit about
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathon View Post
SoL: 20 something know it alls telling other 20 something know it alls they know everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobebyarlant View Post
All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.
Reply With Quote
  #224  
Old 03-16-2018, 11:59 PM
Krainz Krainz is offline

Troubadour
Krainz's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Brazil
Posts: 2,458
BattleTag: Krainz#1972

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noitora View Post
Sylvanas thought she had him under control, and the Horde trusted Sylvanas. For all we know she was the equivalent of a warlock.
But does she stop being a warlock when she sleeps?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #225  
Old 03-17-2018, 05:52 AM
Patrick_C Patrick_C is offline

Chimaera
Patrick_C's Avatar
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 251

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noitora View Post
and the Horde trusted Sylvanas.
Well, then...
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
lore, warcraft

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.