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  #226  
Old 03-17-2018, 06:59 AM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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Well, then...
The Horde is historically known for making stupid ass decisions. Why be surprised?
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  #227  
Old 03-18-2018, 03:35 PM
DerpiusMaximus DerpiusMaximus is offline

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So I've managed to snag a copy of Chronicle Vol 3 from the local Books-a-Million.

Ask me whatever.
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  #228  
Old 03-18-2018, 05:10 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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Originally Posted by DerpiusMaximus View Post
So I've managed to snag a copy of Chronicle Vol 3 from the local Books-a-Million.

Ask me whatever.
Last time I suggested to wait, I got called a slur and ended up being sigged by someone for snapping.

Which faction did what dungeon/raid?

Context on Garrosh "starting" the faction war.
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  #229  
Old 03-18-2018, 08:34 PM
TerrorhoofMayo TerrorhoofMayo is offline

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Originally Posted by ARM3481 View Post
Actually, per the events of the Battle for the Undercity...

Quest:A Life Without Regret



Thrall speaks of them both betraying the Horde. Varimathras' actions wouldn't be considered betrayal if he weren't known to be in the Horde to begin with. Rather, he would seem to Thrall like just some powerful demon who managed to get into the Undercity somehow.
Well that sucks. One could still argue that Thrall found out about Varimathras working for Sylvanas after Wrathgate, but it's a flimsy one at best.
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Moreover, in Orgrimmar when he tells Jaina what's happened he refers to Varimathras familiarly as he would someone they both know of, rather than "a demon named Varimathras" as one logically would if he were talking about some demon who was suddenly and unexpectedly present in the Undercity.
If you are talking about the following conversation, all mentions of Varimathras was done by Sylvanas.
Quote:
Thrall says: Kor'kron, stand down!
Thrall says: Jaina...
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: Thrall, what has happened? The King is preparing for war...
Thrall says: Jaina, what happened at the Wrath Gate. It was a betrayal from within...
Lady Sylvanas Windrunner says: Lady Proudmoore, the Warchief speaks the truth. This subterfuge was set in motion by Varimathras and Grand Apothecary Putress. It was not the Horde's doing.
Lady Sylvanas Windrunner says: As the combined Horde and Alliance forces began their assault upon the Wrath Gate, an uprising broke out in the Undercity. Varimathras and hordes of his demonic brethren attacked. Hundreds of my people were slain in the coup. I barely managed to escape with my life.
Thrall says: The Horde has lost the Undercity.
Thrall says: We now prepare to lay siege to the city and bring the perpetrators of this unforgivable crime to justice.
Thrall says: If we are forced into a conflict, the Lich King will destroy our divided forces in Northrend.
Thrall says: We will make this right, Jaina. Tell your king all that you have learned here.
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: I will deliver this information to King Wrynn, Thrall, but...
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: Bolvar was like a brother to him. In the King's absence, Bolvar kept the Alliance united. He found strength for our people in our darkest hours. He watched over Anduin, raising him as his own.
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: I fear that the rage will consume him, Thrall. I remain hopeful that reason will prevail, but we must prepare for the worst... for war.
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: Farewell, Warchief. I pray that the next time we meet it will be as allies.
Thrall says: Kor'kron, prepare transport to the Undercity.
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  #230  
Old 03-18-2018, 08:57 PM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is online now

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Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
If you are talking about the following conversation, all mentions of Varimathras was done by Sylvanas.
Correct. However the point remains that he's spoken of familiarly, indicating all those present would readily know who Varimathras is and why he'd be in the Undercity in the first place.
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  #231  
Old 03-18-2018, 09:11 PM
DerpiusMaximus DerpiusMaximus is offline

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Originally Posted by Noitora View Post
Last time I suggested to wait, I got called a slur and ended up being sigged by someone for snapping.

Which faction did what dungeon/raid?

Context on Garrosh "starting" the faction war.
Blackrock Depths - Alliance victory. Moira stayed behind, drew as much attention as possible to the mountain in order to get people to kill Ragnaros so that the Dark Irons could be free.
Molten Core - Unknown. Hydraxian Waterlords showed up based on Moira's rumors, basically recruited whoever to challenge Ragnaros.
Maraudon - Horde victory. Magram tribe and its leader Warug had no loyalty to Theradras, told the Horde the story of how Desolace happened and the centaur legends on how they came to be. Technically, Warug and his Magram are allies of the Horde and ruled over a united centaur, who were now bloodlust free with Theradras's death.
Dire Maul - Horde victory. Found out about Immol'thar, banished it to the Nether, pissed off and fought the highborne there, killed Prince Tortheldrin, and scattered the survivors into the wilds who were left to wean off from the magic. Also killed Gordok.
Blackrock Spire & Blackwing Lair - Horde victory. In a means to secure Shadowforge City, Moira made sure to spread news about Rend's "true Horde" in the Blackrock Spire - doubly making sure the news reached Orgrimmar. Rend is killed by the Horde. Horde marches into Blackwing Lair and kills Nefarian, as well, taking Neferian's head back to Orgrimmar.
Wailing Caverns - Horde victory.
Sunken Temple - Alliance victory.
Dragons of Nightmare - Seems like both sides, not exactly clear. Some green dragons saved, most killed.
Zul'Gurub - Horde victory. Zandalari sent word to the Horde through the Darkspear. Horde strike force actually allowed their own blood to be poisoned to poison Hakkar, who could not stop feasting on their blood due to his nature to consume blood. Thus making the raid mechanic canon as well. (Corrupted Blood outbreak, however, is seemingly not canon, lame).
Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj - Horde victory. Saurfang led the Might of Kalimdor forces in a dual strike against C'thun's forces. The Horde tackled the qiraji in the Ruins.
Temple of Ahn'Qiraj - Alliance victory. The other half of the strike went to fight C'thun himself. First Old God death goes to the Alliance.
Naxxramas - Alliance Victory. Canonwise, it seems like raiders never actually fought Alexandros Mograine as one of the Four Horsemen. Darion, the Argent Dawn's first raid on Naxxramas, and Darion's self-sacrifice to free his father's soul and save Light's Hope Chapel by impaling himself with the blade, all occurred before the Alliance heroes came to Naxx40 and killed Kel'thuzad. Afterwards, Naxxramas fucked off to Northrend.

Magtheridon's Lair - Horde victory.
Coilfang Reservoir - Alliance victory.
Tempest Keep - Horde victory.
Black Temple - Unified Horde, Alliance, and Shattrath City's forces victory
Zul'Aman - Horde victory.
Magister's Terrace - Horde victory.
Sunwell Plateau - Alliance victory (mostly thanks to Anveena's sacrifice).

Onyxia - Alliance victory. As told in the comics about Varian. Takes place after TBC, before Wrath. Her head was strung up in Stormwind.

Naxxramas 2 - Mutual Horde and Alliance victory. States that some heroes, it was their second time in Naxxramas. Also, rumors spread that Kel'thuzad's soul was lost to the Shadowlands (aka - Blizz tries to explain why he never came back a 3rd time despite his phylactery never being touched on).
Eye of Eternity - "Azeroth's defenders." Wyrmrest Accord led the attack, and like the raid, Alexstraza showed up with her dragonflight.
Halls of Stone - Alliance heroes victory.
Halls of Lightning - Horde heroes victory.
Ulduar - Horde and Alliance heroes victory. All three Ulduar instances take place after the Ulduar raid trailer. Obviously, it was basically just champions from each respective faction as the Horde and Alliance were deadset against each other after the Battle of Undercity. Canonwise, several heroes were lost to the insanity Yogg-Saron caused them. Algalon's fight occurred a short time after Yogg-Saron's defeat, with Brann gathering up the previous heroes who survived to fight him.
Trial of the Crusader - It barely gets a passing mention. Nothing about Anub'arak or anything lol
Icecrown dungeons - Left pretty vague. "Gunships from both the Horde and the Alliance swooped toward the stronghold and landed their forces at different locations." Mentions only Halls of Reflection by name as a defeat for the "mortal champions."
Icecrown Citadel - Also left relatively vague. Just called "Tirion Fordring and his followers" and "strike team" and other such generic things. Varok was heartbroken by his son being turned into the DK, Alliance are said to have also sympathized. Nothing mentioned about which side got to him first.
Cata dungeons, Skywall - Alliance and Horde heroes. Basically, the factions were too embroiled fighting each other during Cata, but some heroes from two factions did stuff in various zones and dungeons to help the various neutral factions to combat N'Zoth's plans and machinations. Al'Akir's defeat was the first major setback for N'Zoth.
Grim Batol - Alliance victory. The red dragonflight came to their aid and together they kicked out the Twilight's Hammer.
Bastion of Twilight - Horde victory. Aided by Garona, who had no joined the new Horde. Sintharia is only mentioned in passing in one of those small subsections.
Blackwing Descent - ???. Nefarian's 2nd death is also only briefly mentioned, in the very same passage and sentence as Sintharia. "...the horde and Alliance vanquished Nefarian and Sintharia." That's it for them. It was more of subsection discussing the Twilight dragons tbh.
Firelands - "Azeroth's defenders."
End Time dungeon - Horde victory. Helped Nozdormu defeat his infinite self.
Well of Eternity dungeon - Alliance victory. Helped Nozdormu obtained the Dragon Soul.
Hammer of Twilight dungeon - Sorta not canon I guess? No mention of the Thrall Escort Quest stuff from the dungeon. Most of the events of the dungeon, like Benedictus's death, are more or less just chucked into the Dragon Soul raid's description.
Dragon Soul raid - Alliance, Horde, Aspects, Dragonflights, etc. Honestly, even more meh than the actual raid was. No mention of Spine of Deathwing, though they did chase Deathwing through the skies to the Maelstrom. Aspects are still depowered, but nothing said about their ability to hatch new eggs.

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  #232  
Old 03-18-2018, 09:18 PM
TerrorhoofMayo TerrorhoofMayo is offline

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Originally Posted by ARM3481 View Post
Correct. However the point remains that he's spoken of familiarly, indicating all those present would readily know who Varimathras is and why he'd be in the Undercity in the first place.
A single mention doesn't really count spoken of familiarly. At the same time, Thrall can find out just after Wrathgate, and still refer it as a betrayal without the statement contradicting his knowledge of a person.
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  #233  
Old 03-18-2018, 09:42 PM
GenyaArikado GenyaArikado is offline

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Originally Posted by DerpiusMaximus View Post
So I've managed to snag a copy of Chronicle Vol 3 from the local Books-a-Million.

Ask me whatever.
Anything new about Azshara or Vashj? Does it state why did the naga help Illidan?
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  #234  
Old 03-18-2018, 11:45 PM
Pepe Stormstout Pepe Stormstout is offline

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Originally Posted by DerpiusMaximus View Post
So I've managed to snag a copy of Chronicle Vol 3 from the local Books-a-Million.

Ask me whatever.
I'm mostly curious about Old God stuff.
  • Does it conclusively state whether C'Thun and Yogg-Saron are perma-dead or not? Sometimes it's been implied or speculated that we only killed a small avatar of them or that they can't truly die, while other times it's stated that we did actually kill them for real, so any clarification on their current status would be neat.
  • What does the book say about the relationship between Yogg-Saron/saronite and the Scourge?
  • Finally, I'm mostly just curious about everything the book says about N'Zoth, since from the previews it looks like it has more of an explicit role during the events of Cataclysm than before.

Also, I'm wondering how they handled the Med'an story arc from the comic since it looks like they're completely ignoring Med'an himself, so things like the Theramore peace summit, the New Council of Tirisfal, Cho'gall mutating and trying to resurrect C'Thun in Ahn'Qiraj before being defeated, and Aegwynn's death. Did any of those events still happen, just without Med'an, or did they retcon or ignore them?
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  #235  
Old 03-19-2018, 12:05 AM
Krainz Krainz is offline

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Originally Posted by Pepe Stormstout View Post
Does it conclusively state whether C'Thun and Yogg-Saron are perma-dead or not?
They aren't dead because they can't be killed when they aren't really alive to begin with.
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  #236  
Old 03-19-2018, 01:28 AM
Pepe Stormstout Pepe Stormstout is offline

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Originally Posted by Krainz View Post
They aren't dead because they can't be killed when they aren't really alive to begin with.
Ghur'sha and Volazj claim that "they are outside the cycle", but, just as an example, C'Thun's Legacy and March Badness claim that C'Thun was killed by adventurers. I was hoping Chronicle would clear up any potential ambiguity and state things conclusively so that we can know which sources to consider canon.
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  #237  
Old 03-19-2018, 12:14 PM
Krainz Krainz is offline

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Originally Posted by Pepe Stormstout View Post
Ghur'sha and Volazj claim that "they are outside the cycle", but, just as an example, C'Thun's Legacy and March Badness claim that C'Thun was killed by adventurers. I was hoping Chronicle would clear up any potential ambiguity and state things conclusively so that we can know which sources to consider canon.
The most recent blue input on that is what I said.
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  #238  
Old 03-19-2018, 01:04 PM
Pepe Stormstout Pepe Stormstout is offline

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Originally Posted by Krainz View Post
The most recent blue input on that is what I said.
Source?
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  #239  
Old 03-19-2018, 01:09 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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On one hand, it's smart for Moira to play both sides to earn her people's freedom. On the other hand, that's a big gamble since they could've just conquered the Dark Iron (more). Weird that Sunwell wasn't both factions.
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  #240  
Old 03-19-2018, 02:53 PM
Marthen Marthen is offline

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Originally Posted by DerpiusMaximus View Post
Zul'Aman - Horde victory.
Since you've started giving out spoilers anyway, I'll just throw a little clarification here; Zul'Aman is specifically done by a Thalassian strike force that assasinates Zul'jin and his priests to stop his invasion-in-preparation before it can even begin, as the Horde armies, including the blood elf military, are fighting on Outland and defending Quel'Thalas from an actual invasion would have been very complicated.
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  #241  
Old 03-19-2018, 03:00 PM
Mordecay Mordecay is offline

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Thanks for the raid info! I'm more hyped to see the details.

Just curious about the Ahn'qiraj raids being divided into Alliance and Horde yet it was the Might of Kalimdor. So Saurfang led the Horde MoK into the Ruins, but is there a leader for the Alliance part of MoK for the Temple?

The Naxxramas bit is surprisingly correct, seems to be in line with the Ashbringer comic, IIRC.

Bummer that Sunwell was just Alliance, since the events there were being coordinated by the Shattered Sun Offensive, I hoped it would be both (or all three with SSO).

Any word on Shadowfang and Blackfathom? Bloodsworn hinted that these two were raided (or at least attacked at one point, not sure with the wording) by Horde but I suspect that Blackfathom will be Alliance. And what about Zul'Farrak?
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  #242  
Old 03-19-2018, 03:11 PM
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Bummer that Sunwell was just Alliance, since the events there were being coordinated by the Shattered Sun Offensive, I hoped it would be both (or all three with SSO).
It's all three on Quel'Danas, it's just that the Horde goes after Kael in the terrace while the Alliance assaults the Sunwell Plateau.
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  #243  
Old 03-19-2018, 04:56 PM
Krainz Krainz is offline

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Originally Posted by Pepe Stormstout View Post
Source?
I was unable to find it right now, all I know the most recent input was done around early February. Perhaps a Q&A? Not sure.

EDIT: I was able to find this from september http://www.wowhead.com/bluetracker?topic=17616982014
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  #244  
Old 03-19-2018, 04:57 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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It's all three on Quel'Danas, it's just that the Horde goes after Kael in the terrace while the Alliance assaults the Sunwell Plateau.
Pretty sure he meant he expected something like how Black Temple was portrayed.
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All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.
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  #245  
Old 03-21-2018, 07:17 AM
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I also just got my copy.
Reading it now and will look at some of your questions.

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Originally Posted by GenyaArikado View Post
Anything new about Azshara or Vashj? Does it state why did the naga help Illidan?
Yes, it does. (p.86)

The Naga helped him, because the Old Gods ordered it.

They thought that destroying the Lich King would spark a new war between the Undead, the World's Nations and the Legion. This would would create an opportunity for Cho'gall and the Twilights to finally awake them without or few opposition.

--------------

P.132 has an interesting note about Alternate Timelines.

Only the Main Timeline is stable. All other Timelines, if left alone, will eventually dissipate into nothing.

However, if an effort is made to preserve or alter an Alternate Timeline, it can remain in existance indefinetly.

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Originally Posted by Pepe Stormstout View Post
I'm mostly curious about Old God stuff.
  • Does it conclusively state whether C'Thun and Yogg-Saron are perma-dead or not? Sometimes it's been implied or speculated that we only killed a small avatar of them or that they can't truly die, while other times it's stated that we did actually kill them for real, so any clarification on their current status would be neat.
  • What does the book say about the relationship between Yogg-Saron/saronite and the Scourge?
  • Finally, I'm mostly just curious about everything the book says about N'Zoth, since from the previews it looks like it has more of an explicit role during the events of Cataclysm than before.

Also, I'm wondering how they handled the Med'an story arc from the comic since it looks like they're completely ignoring Med'an himself, so things like the Theramore peace summit, the New Council of Tirisfal, Cho'gall mutating and trying to resurrect C'Thun in Ahn'Qiraj before being defeated, and Aegwynn's death. Did any of those events still happen, just without Med'an, or did they retcon or ignore them?
- The Book says C'thun and Yogg-Saron "defeated". Since another Old God took over to manipulate the mortals and assign the Twilight into kinda looks as if they are permadead.

- @Saronite: Only a Side Note in a page that got spoiled in the previews.

- N'Zoth has been Cho'galls new master after Yoggs defeat and during the events of Cata. He was also behind Deathwing's empowerment. His main goal was to restore the Black Empire through the Hour of Twilight. (With his servants only being tools and him having to plans to really "reward" them.)

-@Med'an: As already said, he is only mentioned in the Index as 404 and the Chronicles so far made it clear, that he was retconned out of existance.

Theramore Peace Summit: Happend and was attacked by Garona and the Twilights as in the comics. (Garona got recaptured by Cho'gall shortly before the events of Vanilla and attached with new mental shakles. After she got capured during the attack on Theramore, Jaina and Aegwynn tried to break them, but failed.)

@New Council of Tirisfal: Not mentioned. They only say that Jaina, Garona and Aegwynn decided to uncover more about the Twilights and it's Goals. Garona later once again went to hunt the Twilights alone.

@AQ/Mutated Cho'gall/C'thun: Not mentioned.

Last edited by Vineyard; 03-21-2018 at 08:51 AM..
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  #246  
Old 03-21-2018, 09:25 AM
Cacofonix Cacofonix is offline

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Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
No. Your claim, your research. Don't try to come at me with bullshit about what the Forsaken did in WoW when the question is whether or not the Horde knew of their battlefield tactics prior to WoW. So either find me how the Horde would know how the Forsaken would operate in a war several years in the future, or fuck off.
->The Undead have a history of being filthy beasts who can't be trusted around Humanity and other non-dead stuff
->Forsaken proceed to rampage on their neighbors

How could Thrall have possibly seen that coming?

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Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
Or they just don't know what happened to him and his crew. It's not like their deaths was on broadcast for the whole world to see.
You're telling me there's nothing suspicious about an army falling of the face of the earth and now a bunch of talking corpses are squatting in Human land?

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Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
He doesn't need a disguise for other people to not know he was there. ffs man, Thrall and the other Horde leaders are a continent away. They aren't going to know who is standing next to Sylvanas, or who is on her payroll. After Wrathgate Sylvanas could have played it like he worked in secret with Putress against her.
Thrall named Varimathas soon after Wrathgate in such a way that he knew he was in the Horde.

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You bringing up Sylvanas getting penalties shows your bias.
That's called being an enabler.

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Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
Nah man. The lore clearly stated why and how the Forsaken got in the Horde. This has been set up since TFT, and is not in anyway some game design limitation. Blizzard fully intended for the Forsaken to join the Horde.
Sure they did. You know that WoW didn't start out with its faction system, right? Among other changes.

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Originally Posted by TerrorhoofMayo View Post
Don't be mad because Blizzard didn't do it your way. I mean yeah, most people on this forum have issues with how Blizzard writes their story, me included. We, most of us at least, just don't act like our way is the only way.
If the Forsaken really are Lordaeron's reanimated citizens and not just monsters wearing their flesh that Sylvanas controls then they shouldn't be enthusiastic about joining greenskins to slaughter their neighbors. Argent Crusade or not, a bunch of Humans saying mean words about them shouldn't override a little thing like being largely Undead Humans with traditions they would have shared in life with other Humans (see the Forsaken's religion from all evidence being a spookier version of what was done in Lordaeron). And Humans stick to what's more like them, not to the foreign.

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So you want to move goalposts since you can't prove Thrall wanted nothing to do with humanity?
I'm failing to see the drive to engage in geopolitics with the Alliance.

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lol what is this, MMO-C? /s
I suppose Blizzard's forums deserve a putdown also. Maybe MMO Champion shouldn't be singled out.
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  #247  
Old 03-21-2018, 10:33 AM
Krainz Krainz is offline

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There are so many unfortunate logical fallacies in your entire post but I think I had to approach this one in special because I bet other competent people like Marthen will just run the hell away from this thread.

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Originally Posted by Cacofonix View Post
If the Forsaken really are Lordaeron's reanimated citizens and not just monsters wearing their flesh that Sylvanas controls then they shouldn't be enthusiastic about joining greenskins to slaughter their neighbors. Argent Crusade or not, a bunch of Humans saying mean words about them shouldn't override a little thing like being largely Undead Humans with traditions they would have shared in life with other Humans (see the Forsaken's religion from all evidence being a spookier version of what was done in Lordaeron). And Humans stick to what's more like them, not to the foreign.
The Seven Kingdoms were far from being a conflict-less lovey-dovey rainbow-colored world of friendship. The Last Guardian makes some good remarks on that.

One tradition Humans have with each other? Killing themselves from time to time.
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  #248  
Old 03-21-2018, 10:45 AM
Pepe Stormstout Pepe Stormstout is offline

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Originally Posted by Vineyard View Post
- The Book says C'thun and Yogg-Saron "defeated". Since another Old God took over to manipulate the mortals and assign the Twilight into kinda looks as if they are permadead.

- @Saronite: Only a Side Note in a page that got spoiled in the previews.

- N'Zoth has been Cho'galls new master after Yoggs defeat and during the events of Cata. He was also behind Deathwing's empowerment. His main goal was to restore the Black Empire through the Hour of Twilight. (With his servants only being tools and him having to plans to really "reward" them.)

-@Med'an: As already said, he is only mentioned in the Index as 404 and the Chronicles so far made it clear, that he was retconned out of existance.

Theramore Peace Summit: Happend and was attacked by Garona and the Twilights as in the comics. (Garona got recaptured by Cho'gall shortly before the events of Vanilla and attached with new mental shakles. After she got capured during the attack on Theramore, Jaina and Aegwynn tried to break them, but failed.)

@New Council of Tirisfal: Not mentioned. They only say that Jaina, Garona and Aegwynn decided to uncover more about the Twilights and it's Goals. Garona later once again went to hunt the Twilights alone.

@AQ/Mutated Cho'gall/C'thun: Not mentioned.
Much appreciated, thanks.

From the info you provided, it doesn't look like there's anything too unexpected given what Matt Burns had already communicated via Twitter, though I am surprised that none of the C'Thun resurrection stuff was mentioned. Seems like Cho'gall's drastic change in appearance from WC2 to Cataclysm would be a detail significant enough to mention, but I guess Blizzard felt otherwise.
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  #249  
Old 03-21-2018, 11:01 AM
Mayto Mayto is offline

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Blackrock Depths - Alliance victory. Moira stayed behind, drew as much attention as possible to the mountain in order to get people to kill Ragnaros so that the Dark Irons could be free.
Molten Core - Unknown. Hydraxian Waterlords showed up based on Moira's rumors, basically recruited whoever to challenge Ragnaros.
Maraudon - Horde victory. Magram tribe and its leader Warug had no loyalty to Theradras, told the Horde the story of how Desolace happened and the centaur legends on how they came to be. Technically, Warug and his Magram are allies of the Horde and ruled over a united centaur, who were now bloodlust free with Theradras's death.
Dire Maul - Horde victory. Found out about Immol'thar, banished it to the Nether, pissed off and fought the highborne there, killed Prince Tortheldrin, and scattered the survivors into the wilds who were left to wean off from the magic. Also killed Gordok.
Blackrock Spire & Blackwing Lair - Horde victory. In a means to secure Shadowforge City, Moira made sure to spread news about Rend's "true Horde" in the Blackrock Spire - doubly making sure the news reached Orgrimmar. Rend is killed by the Horde. Horde marches into Blackwing Lair and kills Nefarian, as well, taking Neferian's head back to Orgrimmar.
Wailing Caverns - Horde victory.
Sunken Temple - Alliance victory.
Dragons of Nightmare - Seems like both sides, not exactly clear. Some green dragons saved, most killed.
Zul'Gurub - Horde victory. Zandalari sent word to the Horde through the Darkspear. Horde strike force actually allowed their own blood to be poisoned to poison Hakkar, who could not stop feasting on their blood due to his nature to consume blood. Thus making the raid mechanic canon as well. (Corrupted Blood outbreak, however, is seemingly not canon, lame).
Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj - Horde victory. Saurfang led the Might of Kalimdor forces in a dual strike against C'thun's forces. The Horde tackled the qiraji in the Ruins.
Temple of Ahn'Qiraj - Alliance victory. The other half of the strike went to fight C'thun himself. First Old God death goes to the Alliance.
Naxxramas - Alliance Victory. Canonwise, it seems like raiders never actually fought Alexandros Mograine as one of the Four Horsemen. Darion, the Argent Dawn's first raid on Naxxramas, and Darion's self-sacrifice to free his father's soul and save Light's Hope Chapel by impaling himself with the blade, all occurred before the Alliance heroes came to Naxx40 and killed Kel'thuzad. Afterwards, Naxxramas fucked off to Northrend.

Magtheridon's Lair - Horde victory.
Coilfang Reservoir - Alliance victory.
Tempest Keep - Horde victory.
Black Temple - Unified Horde, Alliance, and Shattrath City's forces victory
Zul'Aman - Horde victory.
Magister's Terrace - Horde victory.
Sunwell Plateau - Alliance victory (mostly thanks to Anveena's sacrifice).

Onyxia - Alliance victory. As told in the comics about Varian. Takes place after TBC, before Wrath. Her head was strung up in Stormwind.

Naxxramas 2 - Mutual Horde and Alliance victory. States that some heroes, it was their second time in Naxxramas. Also, rumors spread that Kel'thuzad's soul was lost to the Shadowlands (aka - Blizz tries to explain why he never came back a 3rd time despite his phylactery never being touched on).
Eye of Eternity - "Azeroth's defenders." Wyrmrest Accord led the attack, and like the raid, Alexstraza showed up with her dragonflight.
Halls of Stone - Alliance heroes victory.
Halls of Lightning - Horde heroes victory.
Ulduar - Horde and Alliance heroes victory. All three Ulduar instances take place after the Ulduar raid trailer. Obviously, it was basically just champions from each respective faction as the Horde and Alliance were deadset against each other after the Battle of Undercity. Canonwise, several heroes were lost to the insanity Yogg-Saron caused them. Algalon's fight occurred a short time after Yogg-Saron's defeat, with Brann gathering up the previous heroes who survived to fight him.
Trial of the Crusader - It barely gets a passing mention. Nothing about Anub'arak or anything lol
Icecrown dungeons - Left pretty vague. "Gunships from both the Horde and the Alliance swooped toward the stronghold and landed their forces at different locations." Mentions only Halls of Reflection by name as a defeat for the "mortal champions."
Icecrown Citadel - Also left relatively vague. Just called "Tirion Fordring and his followers" and "strike team" and other such generic things. Varok was heartbroken by his son being turned into the DK, Alliance are said to have also sympathized. Nothing mentioned about which side got to him first.
Cata dungeons, Skywall - Alliance and Horde heroes. Basically, the factions were too embroiled fighting each other during Cata, but some heroes from two factions did stuff in various zones and dungeons to help the various neutral factions to combat N'Zoth's plans and machinations. Al'Akir's defeat was the first major setback for N'Zoth.
Grim Batol - Alliance victory. The red dragonflight came to their aid and together they kicked out the Twilight's Hammer.
Bastion of Twilight - Horde victory. Aided by Garona, who had no joined the new Horde. Sintharia is only mentioned in passing in one of those small subsections.
Blackwing Descent - ???. Nefarian's 2nd death is also only briefly mentioned, in the very same passage and sentence as Sintharia. "...the horde and Alliance vanquished Nefarian and Sintharia." That's it for them. It was more of subsection discussing the Twilight dragons tbh.
Firelands - "Azeroth's defenders."
End Time dungeon - Horde victory. Helped Nozdormu defeat his infinite self.
Well of Eternity dungeon - Alliance victory. Helped Nozdormu obtained the Dragon Soul.
Hammer of Twilight dungeon - Sorta not canon I guess? No mention of the Thrall Escort Quest stuff from the dungeon. Most of the events of the dungeon, like Benedictus's death, are more or less just chucked into the Dragon Soul raid's description.
Dragon Soul raid - Alliance, Horde, Aspects, Dragonflights, etc. Honestly, even more meh than the actual raid was. No mention of Spine of Deathwing, though they did chase Deathwing through the skies to the Maelstrom. Aspects are still depowered, but nothing said about their ability to hatch new eggs.
Could you elaborate on the Alliance's involvement with the Dark Iron? And BRD
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  #250  
Old 03-21-2018, 01:52 PM
Vineyard Vineyard is offline

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Originally Posted by Pepe Stormstout View Post
Much appreciated, thanks.

From the info you provided, it doesn't look like there's anything too unexpected given what Matt Burns had already communicated via Twitter, though I am surprised that none of the C'Thun resurrection stuff was mentioned. Seems like Cho'gall's drastic change in appearance from WC2 to Cataclysm would be a detail significant enough to mention, but I guess Blizzard felt otherwise.
Technically, he could have been mutated/empowered, when he performed the Ritual to free C'Thun. (Which lead to the AQ War.)

The Ritual unleashed lots of energy, which killed most of the cultists, who have taken part. (The Rest became catatonic and was abandoned by Cho'gall in the desert.)

Last edited by Vineyard; 03-21-2018 at 02:23 PM..
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