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Old 12-14-2009, 10:46 AM
Revenant Revenant is offline

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Default Goblin Cartels

MMO Champion reported that someone at BlizzCon said:

"Goblins are a technological race from Kezan, their society is broken up into trade cartels run by trade princes. They are new factions and not the ones you can already see in game."

http://www.mmo-champion.com/news-2/w...preview-panel/

Whether this is true or not, it brings up the interesting question of what is left for the other three cartels to do, if each of the five(ish) princes runs a cartel.

We have:

The Steamwheedle Cartel, presumably run by Trade Prince Steamwheedle – Runs several neutral towns, neutral banks, the neutral auction house, arena PvP, holidays (through Smokeywood Pastures), and who knows what else. Dark Factions also says they run the shipping division of the Trade Coalition.

The Bilgewater Cartel, presumably run by Trade Prince Maldy – Runs the main port city on Kezan (the heart of the goblins' merchant empire).

Dark Factions (and to a lesser extent, Lands of Mystery) talks about several groups within the Trade Coalition (the name for the goblins' united merchant empire), but does not call any of them a cartel.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Goblin_organizations

What is left for the other three cartels to do, assuming there is little-to-no redundancy? Is the Venture Company a cartel? What about B.O.O.M.? The sappers?
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  #2  
Old 12-14-2009, 01:02 PM
Euphemialibritannia Euphemialibritannia is offline

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Lands of Mystery states that the venture co. is not one of the five main trade cartels run by the princes, but a smaller venture created by mogul Razdunk.
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Old 12-14-2009, 01:05 PM
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Lands of Mystery states that the venture co. is not one of the five main trade cartels run by the princes, but a smaller venture created by mogul Razdunk.
Yeah. I was just putting it out there.
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Old 12-14-2009, 01:46 PM
Wart Wart is offline

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Great Sea Expansion with Undermine as City

Cartel #1 = Horde Faction, rivals with Cartel #2
Cartel #2 = Alliance Faction, rivals with Cartel #1
Cartel #3 = Neutral Faction, the biggest, most successful Cartel
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Old 12-14-2009, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wart View Post
Great Sea Expansion with Undermine as City

Cartel #1 = Horde Faction, rivals with Cartel #2
Cartel #2 = Alliance Faction, rivals with Cartel #1
Cartel #3 = Neutral Faction, the biggest, most successful Cartel
What would the point of that be? There's already a Horde goblin faction.
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Old 12-14-2009, 02:47 PM
SicilianNecktie SicilianNecktie is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wart View Post
Great Sea Expansion with Undermine as City

Cartel #1 = Horde Faction, rivals with Cartel #2
Cartel #2 = Alliance Faction, rivals with Cartel #1
Cartel #3 = Neutral Faction, the biggest, most successful Cartel
Doubtful. Gnomes hate Goblins with a passion.
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Old 12-14-2009, 03:16 PM
Revenant Revenant is offline

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But what would they be about? Just Horde-liking and Alliance-liking? I think the Horde is covered by the Bilgewaters.
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It'd be nice if they actually finally gave us things they cut or under utilized 10 years ago.
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Old 12-14-2009, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Saim View Post
What would the point of that be? There's already a Horde goblin faction.
In the same way that Shatt and Dalaran are Scryer/Aldor and Sunreaver/Silver Covenant, I meant that Undermine would be Horde (Either Non-Bilgewater or Bilgewater with a seperate rep) Goblin Faction/Alliance Goblin faction. If Undermine were to ever be a neutral capital, it would be inevitable split in such a way and can you see the two factions being anything other than Goblins?
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Old 12-14-2009, 04:52 PM
HalfElfDragon HalfElfDragon is offline

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Originally Posted by Wart View Post
In the same way that Shatt and Dalaran are Scryer/Aldor and Sunreaver/Silver Covenant, I meant that Undermine would be Horde (Either Non-Bilgewater or Bilgewater with a seperate rep) Goblin Faction/Alliance Goblin faction. If Undermine were to ever be a neutral capital, it would be inevitable split in such a way and can you see the two factions being anything other than Goblins?
I could see Gnomes taking over a portion. Though I actually see Zandalar being the neutral part with quick boats to Undermine and Kul Tiras
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Old 12-14-2009, 04:55 PM
SicilianNecktie SicilianNecktie is offline

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If Undermine were to be split between 2 major leftover group of goblins, I'm sure it'd be over how to make money. For example, one all about gathering raw resources, another all about crafting it. Profession benefits from each such as increased loot from mineral veins or herbs, or reduced cost/unique crafts from the other. I dunno that they'd be split Horde/Alliance, it just seems too unrealistic.
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Old 12-14-2009, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by SicilianNecktie View Post
If Undermine were to be split between 2 major leftover group of goblins, I'm sure it'd be over how to make money. For example, one all about gathering raw resources, another all about crafting it. Profession benefits from each such as increased loot from mineral veins or herbs, or reduced cost/unique crafts from the other. I dunno that they'd be split Horde/Alliance, it just seems too unrealistic.
Resource gathering and manufacturing might work. You do not see much factories around.
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It'd be nice if they actually finally gave us things they cut or under utilized 10 years ago.
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Old 12-14-2009, 05:33 PM
SicilianNecktie SicilianNecktie is offline

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Resource gathering and manufacturing might work. You do not see much factories around.
Or, you could see a Syndicate/Ravenholdt split; quantity vs. quality, manufactured vs. unique, craftsmanship vs. efficiency. I see a pretty interesting hook here!
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Old 12-14-2009, 08:08 PM
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I'm wondering why the neutral goblins haven't offered more services to the Alliance. I know many might still bear grudges from the Second War, goblins seem much more practical and greedy than emotional and vengeful. And the young goblins wouldn't have been in the War. I can see one of the Cartels, perhaps under the leadership of one of these younger, new-generation goblins setting up an Alliance sanctuary in Undermine. Or, whatever/whomever the focus of a subsequent expac, it could be heinous and evil enough that the goblins and gnomes team up to build some BFG to destroy it. If such is the case, then there is a case for gnomes having a small section of Undermine. They don't have to like each other. In fact the rivalry should be very pronounced.
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Old 12-15-2009, 06:32 AM
Rolandius Rolandius is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revenant View Post
MMO Champion reported that someone at BlizzCon said:

"Goblins are a technological race from Kezan, their society is broken up into trade cartels run by trade princes. They are new factions and not the ones you can already see in game."
The bold sentence isn't new.

From Dark Factions, "Despite their seemingly chaotic natures, goblins exist in a fairly strict and straightforward hierarchy. From the highest to the lowest:

Trade Prince: The five (more or less) rulers of the goblin world, each runs his own private army (or armies), holds lands around Azeroth, and collectively controls the Trade Coalition."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wart View Post
Great Sea Expansion with Undermine as City

Cartel #1 = Horde Faction, rivals with Cartel #2
Cartel #2 = Alliance Faction, rivals with Cartel #1
Cartel #3 = Neutral Faction, the biggest, most successful Cartel
That is assuming Undermine survives the Cataclysm.

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I'm wondering why the neutral goblins haven't offered more services to the Alliance. I know many might still bear grudges from the Second War, goblins seem much more practical and greedy than emotional and vengeful. And the young goblins wouldn't have been in the War.
They have but it isn't shown in-game much. Stuff found in shops, weapons, zeppelins, etc. are sold to either side.
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Old 12-15-2009, 09:33 AM
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Though I actually see Zandalar being the neutral part with quick boats to Undermine and Kul Tiras
Yeah, I always saw it like that. Kul Tiras and Undermine could become racial capitals, with new roles, like PvP, for example. The best neutral capital is Zuldazar, no doubt.

They could join later, when action leaves Azeroth for new places, like the Emeral Dream or the Twisting Nether, as I already posted at the new expansions list .

Quote:
Originally Posted by SicilianNecktie View Post
If Undermine were to be split between 2 major leftover group of goblins, I'm sure it'd be over how to make money. For example, one all about gathering raw resources, another all about crafting it. Profession benefits from each such as increased loot from mineral veins or herbs, or reduced cost/unique crafts from the other. I dunno that they'd be split Horde/Alliance, it just seems too unrealistic.
New faction against faction tension! Help the proletarians or the burgesses rule the city, and experience the new gameplay of the new PvP battles: Demonstrations and strikes abound! Dental plan for everyone, death to Burns!, er, I went off the tangent xDDD.
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Old 12-15-2009, 10:28 AM
Ellavana Ellavana is offline

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New faction against faction tension! Help the proletarians or the burgesses rule the city, and experience the new gameplay of the new PvP battles: Demonstrations and strikes abound! Dental plan for everyone, death to Burns!, er, I went off the tangent xDDD.
Hmm, sounds like Renaissance era Florence or Siena. That could work as a Scyer/Aldor equivalent in some upcoming expansion. Pick the cartel you want to offer your services to (you would be an employee of most likely the "freelance" variaty, kind of like your relationship with The Consortium). Sounds like a good addition to a South Seas type of expansion.

Regarding why we don't see much of goblin interaction with the Alliance: likely due to both the Dwarves and the Gnomes. Goblins tend to be quite technological however in the case of the Alliance, there already two technology minded races. The Alliance does not need an outside source of machines and explosives as the Dwarves and Gnomes already fill that need. The Horde on the other hand does not have much in the way of "high technology (aka machines/explosives/gadgets), thus the Goblins have a good market.
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Old 12-15-2009, 12:08 PM
SicilianNecktie SicilianNecktie is offline

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I was trying to say, most Goblins won't offer their loyalty to anyone, even if they are a current customer. The only reason the Bilgewater cartel joined the Horde was out of necessity, from what it appears. It was either join them, or try to fight off the Alliance's most elite of assassins with coconuts and wet gunpowder. (Though looking at their ingenuity, they might find something eventually)

As for our Proletariot vs. Capitalist fight, that would be really cool; with the destruction of the past Goblin society, they return to find a newly formed island of Kezan from the volcano's explosion. Because their entire city is destroyed, it must be rebuilt, along with a new government established.
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Old 01-01-2010, 05:13 PM
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I am bringing this back. The point is that we don't know, but there can still be speculation.

I ask again: What is left for the other three cartels to do, assuming there is little-to-no redundancy?

What I did get from the responses is that whatever they do, it seems to have never left Undermine.
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It'd be nice if they actually finally gave us things they cut or under utilized 10 years ago.
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Ten.

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Old 01-01-2010, 05:56 PM
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Perhaps they're involved in some form of manufacturing, rather than trade? If that's the case, they may have no reason to leave Undermine.
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Old 01-01-2010, 08:36 PM
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Maybe one specializes in alchemy like creating hobgoblins.
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Old 01-01-2010, 08:47 PM
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Maybe one specializes in alchemy like creating hobgoblins.
I doubt the Alchemists' Union of Dark Faction is a cartel.
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Old 01-02-2010, 05:51 AM
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I think that they control certain major forces in the goblin society:

Steamwheedle cartel: controls the trade
Bilgewater cartel: controls the trade
Unknown cartel #1: controls the Tinkers
Unknown cartel #2: controls the Alchemists
Unknown cartel #3: controls the venture company?

I think that the Bilgewater and Steamwheedle "oppose" each other somehow. BW is the legal one, but they use the law to fill their interests. They use it to become monopoly. SW, in the other side, is the illegal one, trading without paying taxes and whatever.

In the end, the BW are the greedy traders that trade for their benefits, not caring about anyone, and the SW are more liberal, not abusing on their power to get more money.

It matches with the Bilgewater-Edj relationship at Kezan. Edj is controlled by the Steamwheedle, and acts like a Booty Bay 2, while Bilgewater doesn't allow illegal activities like contraband and slaves (but in the end, they are the ones enslaving, while Edj is the only moral one).

I think you get what I'm saying, more or less. Pretty much like Raynor and Mengsk of StarCraft.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Venture Company was owned by the Bilgewaters. If not, they would be part of that 5th unknown cartel.

The other 3 cartels would operate just at Kezan. Their products would be sold by the trading cartels.
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Old 01-02-2010, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revenant View Post
I am bringing this back. The point is that we don't know, but there can still be speculation.

I ask again: What is left for the other three cartels to do, assuming there is little-to-no redundancy?

What I did get from the responses is that whatever they do, it seems to have never left Undermine.
My answer to that would be that the Azeroth we know now is only one side of the coin. They would be operating in parts of Azeroth that we have yet to explore
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Old 01-02-2010, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SicilianNecktie View Post
Doubtful. Gnomes hate Goblins with a passion.
Gnomes only hate goblins because of there reputation with engineering (love making explosives) but they probably have traded with them on many occasions and the Gnomish young could easily learn to like them.

They are not taught from young that Goblins = enemies/hated its just competition that causes that in later life but only for the gnomish enginers i dont think the gnome mages and warlocks for example care about goblins at all.
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Old 01-02-2010, 11:44 AM
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Gnomes only hate goblins because of there reputation with engineering (love making explosives) but they probably have traded with them on many occasions and the Gnomish young could easily learn to like them.

They are not taught from young that Goblins = enemies/hated its just competition that causes that in later life but only for the gnomish enginers i dont think the gnome mages and warlocks for example care about goblins at all.
Goblins also hate the Gnomes. Its mutual hatred
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