Scrolls of Lore Forums  

Go Back   Scrolls of Lore Forums > WarCraft Discussion > World of WarCraft Discussion

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #13426  
Old 09-22-2017, 05:34 PM
Sift Sift is offline

Demon Hunter
Sift's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 452

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krakhed View Post
Yeah, that's the kind of thing I'd expect some, not all, Light entities to do. It's entirely within the range of what the Light could be used for, if someone believed that result to be ideal.

Though it might be too peaceful for someone like Odyn. Actually, I think Light-wielders like Odyn and Xe'ra introduced in Legion, who have or have tried to force others to do things their way for the greater good, are probably a good contrast for Illidan. They're very similar, except for one minor detail.

Illidan doesn't believe he's good or that the things he's doing are right. By turning down redemption, he's chosen a path that leads to him being imprisoned with Sargeras for eternity. Returning to that same hell that lasted 10,000 years. In a sense, he's chosen to be punished for his crimes rather than rewarded for what he accomplished through them.

That's his sacrifice. He's gone back into the cage, because he knows that's where he belongs.

EDIT: Or to make things clear, with how the Light has always functioned in the lore.

The Church of the Holy Light is right. Those who break their tenets are wrong. The Scarlet Crusade was right. Everyone against them was wrong. Odyn was right. Everyone who refused him was wrong. The Argent Dawn was right. Those who didn't see this were blind. The Argent Crusade was right. How could they not be? The Sha'tar are right. Those who don't see this are ignorant. Xe'ra is right. Impurities merely blind some to this truth. Benedictus was right, and we should have simply ended this life of suffering. Anyone who doesn't see this is hopelessly naive.

That is what Locus-Walker means about how the Light seeks just one path and refuses all others. It's not that the Light itself only believes in one way to be right. It's that everyone who uses it, even if they have different ideals of right and wrong, believe themselves to be right. Which makes those who disagree with them wrong.

However, the Void is sitting in the other corner making an elaborate sculpture of living people stitched together, because that's just a way to pass the time. The reason why the asshole making a human-skin waistcoat has value is because he's the guy who looks at what all the Lightbeings are arguing about and sees it all as made up bullshit. What is "right" to them isn't objective, but what they decided was "right". He won't argue that they believe in the "wrong right", because that idea is foreign to him.
I think this makes a lot of sense. Which leads me to a question - Were there times in the past where Elune or her will, exhibited this "I'm right, everything else is wrong" behavior?
  #13427  
Old 09-22-2017, 05:45 PM
Gurzog Gurzog is offline

Banished
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 14,056
BattleTag: Hulk#2393

Default

I have literally no idea what the hell you guys are talking about right now lol.
  #13428  
Old 09-22-2017, 05:48 PM
Krakhed Krakhed is offline

Arch-Druid
Krakhed's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,313

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sift View Post
I think this makes a lot of sense. Which leads me to a question - Were there times in the past where Elune or her will, exhibited this "I'm right, everything else is wrong" behavior?
Well, it doesn't have to be "everyone else is wrong". Other people can be right too. So long as they don't actually disagree with you. The Argent Crusade would have no reason to see the Cenarion Circle as wrong, even if the Circle didn't focus on Light worship. Though of course the Light is more important than the Emerald Dream. But if the Cenarion Circle actually disagreed with their aims? Then we might get that situation.

That's mostly normal behavior, with the difference being that the Light discourages self-doubt because such things weaken Light-wielders.

How much do we know about the ideals of Elune worship? Are there any sources for what the Night Elves think of other races beliefs? What is their response to those who question their beliefs? All I know is that Tyrande asked Velen to shut the fuck up when he thought Elune might be a Naaru and that he wanted to try a few things that might help communicate with her.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gurzog View Post
I have literally no idea what the hell you guys are talking about right now lol.
Behavioral associates and mechanics of the Light and Void, as depicted by Blizzard, and the range of valid interpretations their natures would allow.

Last edited by Krakhed; 09-22-2017 at 05:50 PM..
  #13429  
Old 09-22-2017, 05:49 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

Elune
Noitora's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 34,692
BattleTag: Chillman#1339

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krakhed View Post
Have you ever actually read any of my posts? I've always argued against the idea that the Light is evil or the Void is good. My argument has always been that the Light is the Light and the Void is the Void.

I've actually regularly stated that the nature of the Light tends towards it being used for benevolent purpose, because the wielder must at least believe they're on the right path. But that is capable of being twisted around. Lots of people can do all sorts of things for what they believe to be the greater good, especially if their faith is absolute. And there's no guarantee that what they believe to be the greater good really is the greater good.

I've also stated that the Void is amoral, and I have no interest in promoting absolute amorality where every action is morally equivalent. That's literally completely fucking insane. However, the tendencies of the Void can open your eyes to possibilities and truths you wouldn't have otherwise considered.

That is my position, and has always been my position. You must be confusing me for someone else if you think I've ever once said that the Light is as evil as the Void. Also, it'd be pretty damn hard to motivate an amoral force to any extreme degree of benevolence.

When it comes down to it, I simply don't believe every belief system and set of moral values that the Light could support is necessarily a good one, and that it's far from impossible to give the Void incentive to do good.
So then what have you been arguing with people about the last few pages?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
Yeah but where would this forum be if not for people speculating endlessly about things Blizzard doesn't give a shit about
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathon View Post
SoL: 20 something know it alls telling other 20 something know it alls they know everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobebyarlant View Post
All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.
  #13430  
Old 09-22-2017, 05:52 PM
Gurzog Gurzog is offline

Banished
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 14,056
BattleTag: Hulk#2393

Default

let us just appreciate the good times in the past when Horde were in intermnent camp, and then revolution happened
  #13431  
Old 09-22-2017, 06:01 PM
Krakhed Krakhed is offline

Arch-Druid
Krakhed's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,313

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noitora View Post
So then what have you been arguing with people about the last few pages?
Exactly what I stated there. I'm not sure where you got your interpretation of my posts, but I never said anything you claimed I said.

The traits of the Light have always allowed for a wide range of acceptable viewpoints, including those that are zealous and uncompromising. The Scarlet Crusade was never a wrong interpretation of the Light, even if Demons interfered with it. These are all forms the Light can take.

Xe'ra's attitude towards the Light generally resembles that of the Church of the Holy Light that excommunicated Tirion and deemed Natalie Seline's teachings of balance to be heretical. This is a valid form the Light can take.

The Sha'tar and other Naaru affiliated with the Draenei are far more accepting of the Void. They are more willing and open with teaching of balance and studying the Void than Xe'ra is, and therefore they actually share more in common with the teachings of Natalie Seline.

In short, the difference between the teachings of the Sha'tar and Xe'ra are similar to that between the Church of the Holy Light and the Cult of Forgotten Shadow. For beings of Light, they are as close to Shadow Cultists as you can get. And this more compromising attitude is also a valid form the Light can take, but ultimately less pure for that compromise.

From Xe'ra's standpoint, everything Velen and his Naaru friends have been doing with the Aurchenai, or the work at Netherlight Temple, or with the Netherlight Crucible, is Void-tainted heresy. So. Are the Void-sympathizers the normal ones? We don't know. They were just the ones who saved Velen and the Draenei, and answered their call on Outland.

Last edited by Krakhed; 09-22-2017 at 06:23 PM..
  #13432  
Old 09-22-2017, 06:45 PM
Deicide Deicide is offline

Arch-Druid
Deicide's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Brazil
Posts: 2,228

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krakhed View Post
EDIT: Or to make things clear, with how the Light has always functioned in the lore.

The Church of the Holy Light is right. Those who break their tenets are wrong. The Scarlet Crusade was right. Everyone against them was wrong. Odyn was right. Everyone who refused him was wrong. The Argent Dawn was right. Those who didn't see this were blind. The Argent Crusade was right. How could they not be? The Sha'tar are right. Those who don't see this are ignorant. Xe'ra is right. Impurities merely blind some to this truth. Benedictus was right, and we should have simply ended this life of suffering. Anyone who doesn't see this is hopelessly naive.

That is what Locus-Walker means about how the Light seeks just one path and refuses all others. It's not that the Light itself only believes in one way to be right. It's that everyone who uses it, even if they have different ideals of right and wrong, believe themselves to be right. Which makes those who disagree with them wrong.

However, the Void is sitting in the other corner making an elaborate sculpture of living people stitched together, because that's just a way to pass the time. The reason why the asshole making a human-skin waistcoat has value is because he's the guy who looks at what all the Lightbeings are arguing about and sees it all as made up bullshit. What is "right" to them isn't objective, but what they decided was "right". He won't argue that they believe in the "wrong right", because that idea is foreign to him.
That's a good explanation, thanks.

But my problem with this new view of the Light is that it eschews what I always believed about the Light: that it led to selflessness. "In the Light, we are one"; "Compassion. Tenacity. Respect."; "Be happier, and the world will be happier; Make the world happier, and you'll be happier". The basic tenets of the Light before this new direction were that you'd need to respect others; be compassionate, and not give up making the world a better place. The new direction basicly forgeits two of the virtues, and instead of the Light drawing us closer despite differences, it makes us fight among themselves for what we believe is the only true path. That bothers me a lot.
__________________
- Sorry for any typos; english's not my primary language.

- A better signature coming soon(ish).
  #13433  
Old 09-22-2017, 07:05 PM
Krakhed Krakhed is offline

Arch-Druid
Krakhed's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,313

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deicide View Post
That's a good explanation, thanks.

But my problem with this new view of the Light is that it eschews what I always believed about the Light: that it led to selflessness. "In the Light, we are one"; "Compassion. Tenacity. Respect."; "Be happier, and the world will be happier; Make the world happier, and you'll be happier". The basic tenets of the Light before this new direction were that you'd need to respect others; be compassionate, and not give up making the world a better place. The new direction basicly forgeits two of the virtues, and instead of the Light drawing us closer despite differences, it makes us fight among themselves for what we believe is the only true path. That bothers me a lot.
Well, the Light is selfless. The people fighting for the Light don't believe they're doing it for themselves. They believe they're doing it for the good of everyone. Selflessness isn't innately good. It can push people to extremes for reasons that don't even benefit themselves in any tangible way. If the Scarlet Crusade were more selfish, they could have just deserted and ran away to Stormwind.

Xe'ra is certainly not without compassion, tenacity, or respect, but the way she bestows these is a little unfortunate. The Light can draw people closer and lead to greater understanding, but that's if there's not some fundamental disagreement in the first place. The Scarlet Crusade and Odyn adopted visions that were incompatible with many others, and they inflexibly held to them. Well, I guess the Scarlet Crusade did allow the "Light" to show them new ideas, but their ideals probably prioritized obedience to the Light.

The desire to do good and feel sure of it isn't a bad thing. The way I understand the necessity of balance between Light and Void, from the perspective of a Light worshiper, is being able to hold onto that piece of doubt that keeps you from completely sealing yourself into a box where right and wrong become entirely absolute and unquestionable. That little bit of doubt that keeps you flexible. Like a window to allow in a fresh breeze and let you gaze upon the world outside.

From a Void-wielders perspective, the balance is about keeping sight of the box. Not losing sight that some things still ought to be considered wrong, that there are still things you should never do. Like how Alleria holds onto the fact that she will never kill her son. That belief, that ray of Light, provides her an anchor from which she can safely navigate the possibilities of the Void.

I think this is the difference between Xe'ra and A'dal. A'dal is still heavily Light-leaning, but he acknowledges the value and importance of the Void. He is open to it. He still exists in a healthy structure of ideals and values, but he's not completely shut off from that which exists outside them. Xe'ra, on the other hand, is doing her best to board up every window, and absolutely refuses to acknowledge any benefit that could be derived from the Void.

A'dal has achieved the balance perfect for him, between conviction and flexibility. Xe'ra has not.

And really, isn't that how it should be? One uses Light to find their way through the Void.

Last edited by Krakhed; 09-22-2017 at 07:20 PM..
  #13434  
Old 09-22-2017, 08:36 PM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is online now

Loremaster
ARM3481's Avatar
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 9,565

Default

That's because those things aren't mutually exclusive. When it comes down to it, the Light seeks certainty. There's only one truth, and that certainty bestows a sense of safety and commonality. It brings with it the positives of steadfast conviction - strengths when you're sure of yourself - and the negatives of stubborn shortsightedness. Because when you're sure of the one true path, that makes everyone and everything share unity in that one true path. That commonality is where the selflessness and altruism come from.

Void encompasses uncertainty. Everything is true in some way, so as surely as everything is certain, nothing is certain. It brings the positives of ambition, impulse and instinct - the way we navigate life when we aren't sure of ourselves - coupled with the negatives of selfishness, recklessness and indifference. Because when every path you might follow is equally true, the only commonality left is certainty in yourself, and even that singular certainty is under constant assault.

Hence when adherents of the Light speak, they speak of everyone and their common place on a shared path with a shared truth that can keep us on our proper course. When adherents and creatures of the Void whisper, it's all about you alone in your truth and everyone else's truths coming at you from all sides to steer you onto every path but your own.

The Light tells us we can find surety and safety if we trust in its truth, while the Void tells us there is no surety, we're never safe, and nothing can be trusted because the only thing we can ever be sure of is that everything's equally, terribly true.

Which is why those who would treat with the Void must learn how to stave off the madness. It's why Locus-Walker told Alleria to seize and hold onto her realization that every possibility she saw in the Void was a lie. That certainty - even certainty in a negative - acts like an anchor amid a raging sea of infinite truths. It gives her a point of reference, so that all those infinite truths don't tear her away from the one thing she's sure of: herself.

And it's why even following the Light can go too far. Selflessness and altruism can be very good things, but their extremity is an abandonment of self worth, a desire to suffer and die for the truth (see: the willing submission to brutal "purification" by Scarlet Crusaders) rather than live for it, and a willingness to apply that same standard to others on the same path. As dreadful as their crimes against others were, there was a sort of twisted, macabre selflessness to the Scarlet Crusade's willingness to basically torture one another on a regular basis just to prove to themselves and each other how right they all were. In a way, being right and being certain of that rightness had become more important to them than anything else.

Incidentally, both Sargeras and Arthas are examples of this as well. That insistence upon always being right, coupled with the willingness to remove anyone else who disagrees. See: Arthas chasing off Uther and Jaina before eliminating the possibility of leaving for his men, and Sargeras eliminating both the other titans and the forces of the Light before truly beginning his battle against the Void in earnest. It wasn't enough that they were right, and it wasn't enough that they did "what had to be done"; anyone else seeking the same end but by a different path had to be smacked down first, even before they set out to follow their one, true path. Eliminating alternatives was every bit as important to them as actually fulfilling their goal, their way.

Illidan had a bit of this, but stops short of plunging into Arthas/Sargeras territory by not, say, making sure we invade Argus by killing Khadgar and Velen in case they might object, or killing Tyrande and Malfurion for opposing his methods in the WotA and Third War. He lives in the moment, falling between Light and Void; he sees the desired culmination of his own path, but puts no stock in it being a foregone outcome. He frequently changes gears because he isn't married to any one way of getting there, as long as he eventually gets there. To Illidan there's no one true path or many true paths to a desired end because the path is whatever you make it into along the way, and the end is only the end if you make it be the end.
  #13435  
Old 09-22-2017, 08:57 PM
Krakhed Krakhed is offline

Arch-Druid
Krakhed's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,313

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ARM3481 View Post
When adherents and creatures of the Void whisper, it's all about you alone in your truth and everyone else's truths coming at you from all sides to steer you onto every path but your own.
That's an interesting interpretation, and I think that even fits with the old RPG idea of the Forgotten Shadow's belief in how the Shadow was shaped by the will of all, Vs. the Holy Light viewpoint of everything being connected by and made one through the Light. Sensing the wills of everyone working at complete odds through the Void would be interesting.

You bring up some good points. I wish I had someone like you around when I used to do Shadow Priest RP. Most of what I could get is people talking about how they hated the living and the Light.
  #13436  
Old 09-23-2017, 06:52 AM
Mertico Mertico is offline

Elune
Mertico's Avatar
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 7,261

Default

The Light is universal.
The Void is relative.
  #13437  
Old 09-23-2017, 07:14 AM
Blayze Blayze is offline

Arch-Druid
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,043

Default

Let's hope Blizzard do this Open Palm/Closed Fist moral 'ambiguity' better than Bioware did.
  #13438  
Old 09-23-2017, 07:46 AM
Patrick_C Patrick_C is offline

Chimaera
Patrick_C's Avatar
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 251

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blayze View Post
Let's hope Blizzard do this Open Palm/Closed Fist moral 'ambiguity' better than Bioware did.
Moral ambiguity is extremely hard to do, IMHO. Mostly it comes off as spineless relativism.

Anyway, I can see Krakhed's point better now about the "values" of both the Void and the Light... But I do stand by my position that these things, or the emphasis on these things, are new. The Cult of the Forgotten Shadow was minor trivia until 7.0.

It's a bit similar to how "Arcane" magic was inherently chaotic and corrupting before, and now it's a force of Order standing against the Fel.

On a related note, what's this about Sargeras fighting the forces of Light? I was under the impression he had no particular beef with the Naaru or the Light until they rescued the Eredar. Was he finthing the Light at around the same time he was killing the Pantheon? Who said that and when?
  #13439  
Old 09-23-2017, 08:22 AM
Noitora Noitora is offline

Elune
Noitora's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 34,692
BattleTag: Chillman#1339

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick_C View Post
Moral ambiguity is extremely hard to do, IMHO. Mostly it comes off as spineless relativism.

Anyway, I can see Krakhed's point better now about the "values" of both the Void and the Light... But I do stand by my position that these things, or the emphasis on these things, are new. The Cult of the Forgotten Shadow was minor trivia until 7.0.

It's a bit similar to how "Arcane" magic was inherently chaotic and corrupting before, and now it's a force of Order standing against the Fel.

On a related note, what's this about Sargeras fighting the forces of Light? I was under the impression he had no particular beef with the Naaru or the Light until they rescued the Eredar. Was he finthing the Light at around the same time he was killing the Pantheon? Who said that and when?
That last paragraph is a leap in logic imo. They never said how long Sargeras fought against the Light, so it could've been after Argus or before it after beating the Titans.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
Yeah but where would this forum be if not for people speculating endlessly about things Blizzard doesn't give a shit about
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathon View Post
SoL: 20 something know it alls telling other 20 something know it alls they know everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kobebyarlant View Post
All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.
  #13440  
Old 09-23-2017, 08:26 AM
Krakhed Krakhed is offline

Arch-Druid
Krakhed's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,313

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick_C View Post
Moral ambiguity is extremely hard to do, IMHO. Mostly it comes off as spineless relativism.

Anyway, I can see Krakhed's point better now about the "values" of both the Void and the Light... But I do stand by my position that these things, or the emphasis on these things, are new. The Cult of the Forgotten Shadow was minor trivia until 7.0.

It's a bit similar to how "Arcane" magic was inherently chaotic and corrupting before, and now it's a force of Order standing against the Fel.

On a related note, what's this about Sargeras fighting the forces of Light? I was under the impression he had no particular beef with the Naaru or the Light until they rescued the Eredar. Was he finthing the Light at around the same time he was killing the Pantheon? Who said that and when?
Well, yes. The emphasis on it is definitely new. This stuff has mostly been present in a few footnotes. A few quotes from the Naaru, a clipping from a magazine article, and an RPG description that had yet to be fully fleshed out. It seems to me that someone on the creative team has had this Light/Void balance idea for a very long time, but it never really had a chance to be explored. However, the idea started showing up more in WoD with the Arakkoa and Apexis.

This actually strikes me as a similar case to everyone being surprised at how demons regenerate in the Nether. It's been lore for a very long time, but it was largely obscure and glossed over ingame. Honestly, Illidan fans were the ones most familiar with the concept, because they saw it as a way to bring him back. It never became widespread knowledge until demons became the main focus, not a side-plot, in WoW itself.

This is what we're seeing with the Light and Void. They have been graduating from side-plot to main focus, so all of the little tidbits of lore concerning them have to be expanded upon and explained in greater detail. Why does A'dal say the creatures of the Void are necessary to the universe? What value do they add that the Light does not? These questions need to be answered if the spotlight moves onto them.

From that perspective, it's easy to see the Scarlet Crusade as an early plot seed for if they decided to explore that angle. The Adherents of Rukhmar were thematically deeply similar, sort of a spiritual successor. Odyn is another prominent example in that same vein. We've been seeing the concept of negative forms of the Light start to be explored since Vanilla, so it always struck me that they were setting up this possibility.

Last edited by Krakhed; 09-23-2017 at 08:41 AM..
  #13441  
Old 09-23-2017, 10:40 AM
Kiraser Kiraser is offline

Arch-Druid
Kiraser's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Saint Petersburg
Posts: 1,214

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krakhed View Post
The Sha'tar and other Naaru affiliated with the Draenei are far more accepting of the Void. They are more willing and open with teaching of balance and studying the Void than Xe'ra is, and therefore they actually share more in common with the teachings of Natalie Seline.

In short, the difference between the teachings of the Sha'tar and Xe'ra are similar to that between the Church of the Holy Light and the Cult of Forgotten Shadow. For beings of Light, they are as close to Shadow Cultists as you can get. And this more compromising attitude is also a valid form the Light can take, but ultimately less pure for that compromise.

From Xe'ra's standpoint, everything Velen and his Naaru friends have been doing with the Aurchenai, or the work at Netherlight Temple, or with the Netherlight Crucible, is Void-tainted heresy. So. Are the Void-sympathizers the normal ones? We don't know. They were just the ones who saved Velen and the Draenei, and answered their call on Outland.
It might also be represented in the design of different naaru. Xe're, a prime naaru, isn't just more glorious-looking - she shines with pure golden Light. While most of the other naaru glow with different colors of Light, even A'dal, the big boss of the Sha'tar has a white glow

Naaru were formed in the Great Dark, not in the Light dimension. So they too can understand the balance of all things in reality. But, Xe'ra, being more ancient and closer to the origianl Light, naturally opposes this notion. I wonder, if she would consider, say, a pink-colored naaru as some peasant.
__________________
тче баттле бегонс...
  #13442  
Old 09-23-2017, 11:10 AM
Deicide Deicide is offline

Arch-Druid
Deicide's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Brazil
Posts: 2,228

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiraser View Post
It might also be represented in the design of different naaru. Xe're, a prime naaru, isn't just more glorious-looking - she shines with pure golden Light. While most of the other naaru glow with different colors of Light, even A'dal, the big boss of the Sha'tar has a white glow

Naaru were formed in the Great Dark, not in the Light dimension. So they too can understand the balance of all things in reality. But, Xe'ra, being more ancient and closer to the origianl Light, naturally opposes this notion. I wonder, if she would consider, say, a pink-colored naaru as some peasant.
I was thinking about this.
Many naaru are of darker colors. Blue, purple, pink. A few were white. Xe'ra is probably purer, hence the golden color.

Maybe Elune, whose light is silvery, is a goddess because she lies in the balance of all forces?
__________________
- Sorry for any typos; english's not my primary language.

- A better signature coming soon(ish).
  #13443  
Old 09-24-2017, 04:27 AM
Nazja Nazja is offline

Trade Baroness - Moderator
Nazja's Avatar
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: All the lands of Wonder.
Posts: 40,949

Default

From MMO-C:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlamin
In 7.3.2, Blizzard shipped 104 files behind a new encryption key (the Silithus stuff is under a different key). Not uncommon, but the unusually large amount and the fact we weren't able to instantly guess a few files behind it got me curious as to what it hides.

Together with some friends, we've managed to get a pretty good overview on what it blocks from view.
  • A mount called raptormount_v2 with 37 new sounds.
  • A mount, probably a horse. Possibly named Seabraid Stallion. Likely still WIP so unable to confirm name.
  • A new battle pet named Tottle. It uses some existing Goren sounds and has ~47 new (still encrypted) files including sounds

Start of speculation

A new raptor mount is very interesting and the possibility of it being combined with a horse (especially one being named Seabraid Stallion) makes it all the more interesting when taken in the same context of Blizzard removing Kul Tiras and Zandalar filenames in 7.3.

My theory right now is that these are CE mounts (and maybe a pet) that'll be unlocked sometime during the lifetime of 7.3.2, maybe with digital prepurchase for the new expansion CE going up sometime after BlizzCon when they expect 7.3.2 to still be on live.

End of speculation

In conclusion:
  #13444  
Old 09-24-2017, 06:14 AM
Ujimasa Hojo Ujimasa Hojo is offline

Eternal
Ujimasa Hojo's Avatar
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Philippines
Posts: 4,215

Default

Isn't Kul Tiras molten slag, from uhh Varian's Cataclysm short story? Also, we need a Makrura trying to convince the trolls why life is better unda da sea through song.
__________________




Watch my Warcraft 3 stuff in either YouTube, BitChute, DailyMotion, DTube, FruitLab, or Brighteon.
  #13445  
Old 09-24-2017, 06:47 AM
Nazja Nazja is offline

Trade Baroness - Moderator
Nazja's Avatar
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: All the lands of Wonder.
Posts: 40,949

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ujimasa Hojo View Post
Isn't Kul Tiras molten slag, from uhh Varian's Cataclysm short story? Also, we need a Makrura trying to convince the trolls why life is better unda da sea through song.
Novel, not short story.
  #13446  
Old 09-24-2017, 07:11 AM
Shandalay Shandalay is offline

Druid of the Talon
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 81

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deicide View Post
I was thinking about this.
Many naaru are of darker colors. Blue, purple, pink. A few were white. Xe'ra is probably purer, hence the golden color.

Maybe Elune, whose light is silvery, is a goddess because she lies in the balance of all forces?
I wanted to quote this to highlight it, because I've been thinking the same thing for some time now.
Maybe what makes Elune so special and different from other deities is, that she is the one true embodiment of Balance. She showed herself to the Nightelves (or rather the dark trolls at first) as a moon-being, but really she is the essence of 'existence', which only came to be as a result of shadow and light. In some cases things have more light than shadow, some others have more shadow than light, but really absolute purity only exists outside of existence. So... there are superior beings ("gods") of Light and superior beings of Shadow, but what about the one thing that makes existence possible? That made me think of Elune as a goddess of Balance.

-----------------

And while questing on Argus and reading the new Alleria/Turalyon story I was thinking about how Argus the Titan is being portrayed. It seemed to me that he was a Titan whose parts that were originally light are now shadow and his original arcane blood is now fel. But both things don't make him evil, he still tries to help his inhabitants with giving them the power over his earth, over his shadows and so on. Ofc he can't so anything too openly, because he's a prisoner himself, but he's not utterly converted, even though he has been kind of turned.
  #13447  
Old 09-24-2017, 08:25 AM
Krakhed Krakhed is offline

Arch-Druid
Krakhed's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 2,313

Default

Something I realized after reading the Audio Drama.

The crooked serpent with no eyes, watching from the endless sky. It has no eyes to see, but it dreams of infinite endings and beginnings.
https://wow.gamepedia.com/Damp_Pamphlet
https://wow.gamepedia.com/Stained_Pa...ion_Invasions)

That's definitely a Void Lord. That is an exact description of how they perceive reality.
  #13448  
Old 09-24-2017, 09:54 AM
Kiraser Kiraser is offline

Arch-Druid
Kiraser's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Saint Petersburg
Posts: 1,214

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiraser View Post
Magni and Brann near the Scarab Gong. It's for that scenario.

Magni, "If the Destroyer is alive, she's in great danger. No wonder she's so troubled..."

"Her nightmares... her greatest fears... we've got to help!"

Brann, "Don't worry, lass. We'll protect ye. We've got to!"
Hmmmmmmph.
__________________
тче баттле бегонс...
  #13449  
Old 09-24-2017, 10:04 AM
Asterisk Asterisk is offline

Arch-Druid
Asterisk's Avatar
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: The Lanes Between
Posts: 1,412

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiraser View Post
Hmmmmmmph.
Ohhh yeah, Brann was going to be part of that. RIP.
  #13450  
Old 09-24-2017, 10:34 AM
Insane Guy of Doom Insane Guy of Doom is offline

Time-Lost Proto Nerd
Insane Guy of Doom's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 10,001

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asterisk View Post
Ohhh yeah, Brann was going to be part of that. RIP.
And the updated Ra-den model that was added at the same time.
Closed Thread

Tags
world of warcraft, wow legion

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:50 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.