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View Poll Results: End game questing to conquer areas we actually care about
This could be fun 7 29.17%
This should happen. 4 16.67%
Never going to happen 8 33.33%
Could be fun but is never going to happen 5 20.83%
Voters: 24. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 08-11-2013, 03:40 PM
Menel'dirion Menel'dirion is offline

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Default If we ever go back to war.....

Fair warning, this is yet another one of my insane mental upchucks.

If they ever have us go back to war with each other, I think it would work a lot better if we actually fought over territory we cared about. I honestly couldn't care less if we conquered/liberated the Jade Forest or Krasarang Wilds for our faction. With phasing implemented so as not to interfere with those who are not in end-game we can actually fight for areas that we want to have.

We receive quests to aid the actual conquest of territories. Once we've conquered a territory, we can receive quests to aid in the conquest of other territories. This happens on a real time level, phased so that players from each faction have to fight over territories with each other. If your faction loses a territory, you have to do the quests to conquer it again from an adjacent territory. The conquered territories will be phased to show your factions occupation of said territory (with or without the opposing factions NPC's there living under your factions rule for as long your there, I'm not sure which). Once you've conquered the territory surrounding a city (such as say, Tirsfal Glades or Elwyn), you unlock a slightly generic raid/dungeon to go in and kill the faction leader in that capital, and you can go on this raid as long as you have control of the surrounding territory. If your faction has been suffering a lot of defeats and have lost all of that territory, your city is where you strike out from in order to take it back, unless you can find another angle to come in from (which might be an option).

Another idea that would take this just a step further would be if this were less about the faction war in general, but more about we, as players doing this as generals/warlords. Quests leading up to the conquest of areas would be us gathering resources or recruiting fighters (could even be fun to choose what kind of fighters we recruit). We could talk to NPC's associated with this feature to manage our armies, and then we speak to our second in commands and tell them "I'm ready to begin the battle for Brill/Goldshire/Thoradin's Wall/Silverwing Post." You then get to join the battle with the Army that you quested to supply, recruit, train, etc. For about a decade we commanded the Armies of Azeroth from above. How much fun could we have if we commanded from the front (or rear if you're a ranged fighter). I would actually imagine having a couple of special abilities given to you as a commander, being able to direct ranged attacks and siege weapons, rallying soldiers to your position, telling them to adopt certain stances (shields up), buffing them, telling them to head a certain direction, etc.

Now I know that I'm going to hear something about this taking too much effort and resources. And you're right, this would be a whole lot of work. However, the beauty of it is that it doesn't have to be implemented all at once. One patch they could open up this kind of warfare for just a few zones in disputed territories like Ashenvale and Arathi. From there just expand the list further and further patch by patch until it reaches everywhere we want to fight. It doesn't have to involve the whole world..... of warcraft.

Think about it. This would be faction war without your faction having to be slapped with the villain bat. Without having to involve rebels to take the city you want to take. Without fighting of territories that mean nothing to you.
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  #2  
Old 08-11-2013, 03:55 PM
Mshadowz Mshadowz is offline

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They should have done this in Cataclysm.
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  #3  
Old 08-11-2013, 04:15 PM
Menel'dirion Menel'dirion is offline

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On the other hand, this could be what we do as part of an Army of Light fighting the Legion. Raising Armies, talking to second in commands, and liberating worlds from the legion. If it works there, then maybe see about implementing it on a PVP level.
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  #4  
Old 08-11-2013, 04:30 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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I don't see how that could work because it assumes that all servers have a 50:50 Alliance/Horde ratio and that both factions have similar numbers of players who would do them.
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  #5  
Old 08-11-2013, 04:42 PM
Menel'dirion Menel'dirion is offline

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I don't see how that could work because it assumes that all servers have a 50:50 Alliance/Horde ratio and that both factions have similar numbers of players who would do them.
thoughts on this:

remember, this is phased so it doesn't affect those not participating.

If on a particular server the community of a faction is strong enough to regularly take and maintain a territory, why shouldn't they keep it until the opposing community can get its act together to retake it? This is where a server's community can really shine. If you grow frustrated with a communities lack of effort or ability in maintaining an area, maybe you should move servers.

Since you can always strike from within your capital city and/or another angle (say from West fall or Redridge to Goldshire, whichever one the enemy isn't coming from), I imagine even on unbalanced servers there will be some back and forth. You really just have to push until you get the raid. You then run the raid. If you get pushed out, push right back. Eventually your opponents sleep and you can take some territory.
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  #6  
Old 08-11-2013, 04:47 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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I have absolutely zero faith in the Alliance community to ever have any interest in putting forth a concerted effort to fight the Horde. The Alliance community has always been ten times as apathetic as the Horde one and the hardcore players tend to gravitate to Horde because of racials. Any instance where the two faction's playerbases are pitted directly against each other is going to result in a Horde victory on the vast majority of servers.

And if your solution to being frustrated with your local community's inability to actually combat the other faction due to population imbalance is to switch servers, then that means that the problem is going to get even worse with servers that are already imbalanced becoming even more imbalanced as people join servers where their faction is dominant for easy wins.
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  #7  
Old 08-11-2013, 04:53 PM
BaronGrackle BaronGrackle is offline

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They should have done this in Cataclysm.
Hillsbrad, Southshore, and Stromgarde for me.

Ashenvale and Gilneas for a few other folks, I imagine.
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  #8  
Old 08-11-2013, 04:55 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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To this day I am still baffled as to why they made it so that stuff that was originally destroyed by the Cataclysm was instead destroyed by the Horde.
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  #9  
Old 08-11-2013, 04:59 PM
Menel'dirion Menel'dirion is offline

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I have absolutely zero faith in the Alliance community to ever have any interest in putting forth a concerted effort to fight the Horde. The Alliance community has always been ten times as apathetic as the Horde one and the hardcore players tend to gravitate to Horde because of racials. Any instance where the two faction's playerbases are pitted directly against each other is going to result in a Horde victory on the vast majority of servers.

And if your solution to being frustrated with your local community's inability to actually combat the other faction due to population imbalance is to switch servers, then that means that the problem is going to get even worse with servers that are already imbalanced becoming even more imbalanced as people join servers where their faction is dominant for easy wins.
I wonder if the prospect of this sort of victory might galvanize them a bit. Regardless, perhaps if it were less permanent and simply phased to individual players/groups/raid parties/guilds to work their way from the front (say... Arathi Highlands) to the enemies doorstep (say Undercity or Ironforge, whichever one you're trying to conquer), with enemy players actions and conquests having no bearing whatsoever on what you are doing, that could solve that issue. Wouldn't be quite as fun though.

I should also point out that Alliance has a bit of an advantage. Marching on Undercity or Silvermoon, or even Orgrimmar or Thunderbluff is really a lot easier than trying to march on and take Teldrassil or Azuremyst Isle. I suppose if Horde Players take Darkshore, they'd have to do a few quests to get an airship built.
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  #10  
Old 08-11-2013, 05:18 PM
MisterCrow MisterCrow is offline

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Originally Posted by Menel'dirion View Post
If on a particular server the community of a faction is strong enough to regularly take and maintain a territory, why shouldn't they keep it until the opposing community can get its act together to retake it? This is where a server's community can really shine. If you grow frustrated with a communities lack of effort or ability in maintaining an area, maybe you should move servers.
On servers that have a huge disparity the ability for Alliance players to "get their act together" is severely limited. This pretty functionally was the problem with Wintergrasp and Tol Barad, because there were some people who flat out didn't get to access the raids behind that content because the other faction could and did shut them out 24/7.

Now, if you remove faction disparity from the equation (on the hope that Virtual Realms actually resolves the issue) then maybe the idea has greater feasibility, but even with that being said, I think you'd need to work really hard to come up with reasons why players are going to want to fight for zone dominance if you don't have the carrot we had in the RTS series, which was "story advancement."

Now, if you wanted to add a phase layer or instance that worked similarly to Guild Wars 2 World vs World then I think you'd have a much stronger leg to stand on.
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  #11  
Old 08-11-2013, 05:39 PM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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I have absolutely zero faith in the Alliance community to ever have any interest in putting forth a concerted effort to fight the Horde. The Alliance community has always been ten times as apathetic as the Horde one and the hardcore players tend to gravitate to Horde because of racials. Any instance where the two faction's playerbases are pitted directly against each other is going to result in a Horde victory on the vast majority of servers.

And if your solution to being frustrated with your local community's inability to actually combat the other faction due to population imbalance is to switch servers, then that means that the problem is going to get even worse with servers that are already imbalanced becoming even more imbalanced as people join servers where their faction is dominant for easy wins.
Wait? It is still like this?
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Old 08-11-2013, 05:45 PM
Mshadowz Mshadowz is offline

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The "Alliance community" is pretty down with fighting Horde. It's Blizzard who isn't down with them fighting the Horde.
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Old 08-11-2013, 05:50 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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The "Alliance community" is pretty down with fighting Horde. It's Blizzard who isn't down with them fighting the Horde.
It's both. On my old rp server where the alliance dominates the horde by like 2-3:1 the horde camped out stormwind for like an hour. Most never bothered to help.

Also on my rp-pvp server where the horde are dominant, no one ever bothers to help out against the alliance unless they're attacking either Orgrimmar or the Undercity.
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All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.
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  #14  
Old 08-11-2013, 06:17 PM
Reignac Reignac is offline

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Where's the "I don't like it" option? Because -*hit with brick before going on war rant*
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You know, when I put the "i hate all of you" tag in threads, I'm not trying to be funny or cute. With a handful of exceptions, I really do hate almost everybody here.

It's one thing to have problems and voice your concerns, but when you endlessly bitch day in and day out about the same tired old shit, it honestly makes me wonder why you are even here. Generally when somebody doesn't like something, they stop caring about it.

And on that note, SoL is a forum I no longer enjoy. So, I'm done here. And I genuinely think the people who have absolutely nothing at all positive to say about the game and, the people whose posts are composed entirely of whining, really consider leaving (or at least sticking to non-WoW sections). Because if you truly get no enjoyment out of WoW, then why are you here?

With that said, goodbye.
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Old 08-12-2013, 04:16 AM
C9H20 C9H20 is offline

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Besides the immense resource drain this would be, just imagine the amount of alternate scenarios they would have to come up with if they don't want this to be a generic territory takeover from GTA SA, think about the story.

Oh yeah, there can be no story. This entire expansion would come down to "and there was worldwide inconclusive fighting, ultimately nothing changed." Totally not a waste of time.
At best they can add a canonical list of battles, but then some issues with MoP style faction war reemerge and you have people whining that it is not how the war went on their server...

Not to mention I am still cynical of Blizzard and faction wars after the last expansion. In short:

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Old 08-12-2013, 05:28 AM
CoDimus the Staunch CoDimus the Staunch is offline

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Could be fun, but will never happen.
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Old 08-12-2013, 06:11 AM
Trickster Trickster is offline

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This should happen but then, only the Horde would have territory to lose so it's not going to be a thing.
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Old 08-12-2013, 11:32 AM
Menel'dirion Menel'dirion is offline

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Besides the immense resource drain this would be, just imagine the amount of alternate scenarios they would have to come up with if they don't want this to be a generic territory takeover from GTA SA, think about the story.

Oh yeah, there can be no story. This entire expansion would come down to "and there was worldwide inconclusive fighting, ultimately nothing changed." Totally not a waste of time.
At best they can add a canonical list of battles, but then some issues with MoP style faction war reemerge and you have people whining that it is not how the war went on their server...

Not to mention I am still cynical of Blizzard and faction wars after the last expansion. In short:

Even with the lack of firm events that you have presented, there's still a way that this could be implemented. Lets hop the trolley to the land of make believe for a moment.

It's the final WoW expansion. Patch X.4 has been released and Sargeras' smoldering remains drift out in the nether. Alliance and Horde, bereft of a larger threat, turn on eachother. We aren't going to get another expansion and WoW 2/ Warcraft 4 are at least 4 Blizzard years out. For at least a little while between now and then, instead they release patches allowing this sort of back and forth zone by zone. The gradual nature of this should help offset the time and resources required.
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