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  #6351  
Old 02-03-2017, 02:44 AM
ijffdrie ijffdrie is offline

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From what I recall, the factions were intended to be a part of vanilla from basically the beginning, but weren't as hardcoded. A character could gain rep with enemy player factions, or lose rep with his own. The fact that you could still go to war with some vanilla NPC factions is kind of a remnant of this intended design.
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  #6352  
Old 02-03-2017, 11:13 AM
Ethenil Ethenil is offline

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Theory: the Maiden of Virtue was a Titanforged construct of Uldaman who sensed a great evil (Sargeras) in the south (Karazhan) and went to investigate, and cleanse it. However, Medivh overpowered her and twisted her purpose to 'cleanse' the place from invaders.
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  #6353  
Old 02-03-2017, 11:54 AM
Nazja Nazja is offline

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Originally Posted by Ethenil View Post
Theory: the Maiden of Virtue was a Titanforged construct of Uldaman who sensed a great evil (Sargeras) in the south (Karazhan) and went to investigate, and cleanse it. However, Medivh overpowered her and twisted her purpose to 'cleanse' the place from invaders.
Unfortunately, she's just a conservative party pooper.

She didn't enjoy The Great Gatsby's... err... Medivh's parties.


Considering that watchers/keepers don't seem to reproduce sexually, being concerned about someone's virtue seems like an odd thing for her to do...
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Old 02-03-2017, 12:24 PM
Revenant Revenant is offline

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Unfortunately, she's just a conservative party pooper.

She didn't enjoy The Great Gatsby's... err... Medivh's parties.


Considering that watchers/keepers don't seem to reproduce sexually, being concerned about someone's virtue seems like an odd thing for her to do...
Consider what Loken and Thorim's relationship with Sif did.
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  #6355  
Old 02-03-2017, 12:34 PM
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Consider what Loken and Thorim's relationship with Sif did.
I'd completely forgotten about them.

By the way, remember the debate about Isiset & friends' rank amongst the titanic watchers? I found more evidence for them having been elevated to Keepers at some point. Not only does that one archeology artifact call them Keepers, but their seat of power is also called Seat of the Keepers. Of course, you could say that all those references were retconned by Chronicle and that they're no longer valid sources, but Chronicle never states that the original Keepers were the only Keepers that have ever existed.
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Old 02-03-2017, 01:28 PM
neoshadow neoshadow is offline

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So with the vale in ruins and barely beginning to move back to a healed state, will this cause a massive ecological collapse for Pandaria, due to the waters of the vale keeping the food of the valley of the four winds abundant?
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  #6357  
Old 02-03-2017, 01:34 PM
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So with the vale in ruins and barely beginning to move back to a healed state, will this cause a massive ecological collapse for Pandaria, due to the waters of the vale keeping the food of the valley of the four winds abundant?
https://wow.gamepedia.com/Quest:Lessons_of_the_Past
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  #6358  
Old 02-03-2017, 01:38 PM
Ethenil Ethenil is offline

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I stand by my theory.
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  #6359  
Old 02-03-2017, 03:00 PM
neoshadow neoshadow is offline

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Thank goodness.
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  #6360  
Old 02-04-2017, 09:31 AM
Ethenil Ethenil is offline

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Two things:

- From Ebonchill:

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The tale of Ebonchill begins with a half-elf mage named Alodi. Though he did not create the staff, he made it into the legendary weapon it is today.

Alodi never knew his real parents. From infancy, he was raised in an orphanage for magically gifted children in Dalaran. His only connection to his parents was Ebonchill, which they had left with the boy when they abandoned him at the school.
Do you think there may be something more to Alodi's parents? A special origin to Ebonchill?

- From Apocalypse:

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There are a few prevailing theories about its current resting place. The first is that Aegwynn buried the sword at the site of her battle with Laith and shrouded it in a veil of magic. The second is that she encased the weapon in an arcane shell and cast it into the fiery heart of Blackrock Mountain.
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The Dark Riders scoured the lands of the Eastern Kingdoms before finally discovering the blade in the Badlands. Despite Aegwynn's efforts to hide Apocalypse, it had somehow surfaced again. Who had abandoned the weapon in this place, Ariden did not know. Nor did he care.
What's the deal with mentioning Blackrock Mountain and the Badlands? I feel like I'm missing something here.
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  #6361  
Old 02-04-2017, 09:40 AM
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Maybe it was carried out of Blackrock in a lava flow and ended up carried into Badlands by Blackrock orcs or Dark Irons?
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Old 02-04-2017, 11:01 AM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is offline

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What's the deal with mentioning Blackrock Mountain and the Badlands? I feel like I'm missing something here.
While only speculated by the sound of it, burying the weapon in the very lava of Blackrock Mountain rather fits with Aegwynn's M.O. with the Avatar of hiding things in places that would be hard for random people to even survive in let alone accidentally stumble across.

Finding it in the Badlands could have any number of connotations. Maybe that's where she really hid it, or maybe it found its way there from Blackrock Mountain or some other place. Though admittedly depending upon the timing of events, Blackrock Mountain could have been under Ragnaros' control by that time, meaning if she indeed the hid Apocalypse there, it's feasible that some Old God shenanigans led to the weapon finding its way out and ending up in the Badlands. Maybe something involving the War of the Three Hammers or the Horde's occupation of BRM. Plus one might recall that the Badlands is where we originally encountered one of Vanilla's more notable ex-Twilight's Hammer cultists (even though he basically became a gag character in Cataclysm.)
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  #6363  
Old 02-04-2017, 11:04 AM
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one of Vanilla's more notable ex-Twilight's Hammer cultists (even though he basically became a gag character in Cataclysm.)
Alas, poor Theldurin.
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  #6364  
Old 02-04-2017, 11:11 AM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is offline

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Alas, poor Theldurin.
The thing is, I'm not completely soured on his character as I would be with a lot of others if they were similarly used because he actually came back later to help players fight at Hyjal. He's presumably still be a bit unhinged (and drunk) from trying to forget his TH days, so having a wacky quest like The Day that Deathwing Came thrown in the mix doesn't totally ruin him for me.

(Plus it at least gave us the one in-game appearance of Deathwing's otherwise unused humanoid form.)
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  #6365  
Old 02-04-2017, 11:18 AM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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The thing is, I'm not completely soured on his character as I would be with a lot of others if they were similarly used because he actually came back later to help players fight at Hyjal. He's presumably still be a bit unhinged (and drunk) from trying to forget his TH days, so having a wacky quest like The Day that Deathwing Came thrown in the mix doesn't totally ruin him for me.

(Plus it at least gave us the one in-game appearance of Deathwing's otherwise unused humanoid form.)
True, but I always kind of hoped he would end up heading the Alliance's studies on the Old Gods as counterpart to Brann, dragged in by Moira and the Dark Irons or something.
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Old 02-04-2017, 11:25 AM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is offline

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True, but I always kind of hoped he would end up heading the Alliance's studies on the Old Gods as counterpart to Brann, dragged in by Moira and the Dark Irons or something.
Something like that could still happen, maybe (even if not with him specifically.) Like if the next time we fight the Old Gods it's handled more like Legion, where the NPC's show more interest in learning about the enemy rather than just going in blind.
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  #6367  
Old 02-04-2017, 11:53 AM
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Something like that could still happen, maybe (even if not with him specifically.) Like if the next time we fight the Old Gods it's handled more like Legion, where the NPC's show more interest in learning about the enemy rather than just going in blind.
I hope it does, though I'd always kind of wanted Drak'thul as his counterpart for the Horde in that sort of group but he shows no interest in repaying his debt to society after WC2
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Old 02-04-2017, 11:56 AM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is offline

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I hope it does, though I'd always kind of wanted Drak'thul as his counterpart for the Horde in that sort of group but he shows no interest in repaying his debt to society after WC2
Then again, his dialogue in WoW implies that part of Drak'thul's indifference toward the current threat seems to be connected to his realizing there's something even worse than the Legion out there. So if the Old Gods/Void Lords come to the fore, we might see him get up the gumption to involve himself in things.
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Old 02-04-2017, 12:31 PM
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Then again, his dialogue in WoW implies that part of Drak'thul's indifference toward the current threat seems to be connected to his realizing there's something even worse than the Legion out there. So if the Old Gods/Void Lords come to the fore, we might see him get up the gumption to involve himself in things.
If he knows then he ought to have the gumption to do something NOW, but I suppose if he couldn't be assed to stop his clan's ghosts from fighting then it's a bit much to expect from him.
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  #6370  
Old 02-07-2017, 12:51 AM
Ethenil Ethenil is offline

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Huh.

Interesting.

Never realized. Izal-Shurah really is Val'sarah or Shal'Aran/Meredil. Dalaran floats over the Stormreaver Reckage. Arauk-Nashal are the gates to Stormheim (Nashal the Watcher being a big deal there).
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  #6371  
Old 02-07-2017, 06:27 AM
Mordecay Mordecay is offline

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Huh.

Interesting.

Never realized. Izal-Shurah really is Val'sarah or Shal'Aran/Meredil. Dalaran floats over the Stormreaver Reckage. Arauk-Nashal are the gates to Stormheim (Nashal the Watcher being a big deal there).
The Azsuna isle doesn't match when compared with Warcraft III missions because it is the first isle where the Watchers make camp and encounter Drak'thul. Now, in the game it is a place of the Vault which is said to have been present since the end of the WotA. Through some retcons it could work, tho.
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  #6372  
Old 02-07-2017, 07:31 AM
Ethenil Ethenil is offline

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The Azsuna isle doesn't match when compared with Warcraft III missions because it is the first isle where the Watchers make camp and encounter Drak'thul. Now, in the game it is a place of the Vault which is said to have been present since the end of the WotA. Through some retcons it could work, tho.
Indeed, I expect it to be nearly completely retconned. We'll have to wait for Chronicles Vol III to get any confirmation about what Maiev and Illidan did and where they went in TFT.

But what I'm more interested in are the names shown in the Warcraft map. I'd love to have a confirmation that Arauk-Nashal truly is Stormheim, for example. The 'famous library' of Izal-Shurah could very well refer to some great library once found in Meredil or, say, Shala'nir.
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  #6373  
Old 02-08-2017, 06:21 AM
Nazja Nazja is offline

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Does Eyir favour Hyrja over the other val'kyr, or why is a novice val'kyr like her treated like a hotshot?
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  #6374  
Old 02-08-2017, 07:11 AM
GenyaArikado GenyaArikado is offline

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In my headcanon, now that the Broken islands were always there and the Islands-that-werent-in-Maiev's-maps refers to the Broken Shore, Izal-Shural library and Arauk-Nashal gardens were retconned as being parts of Thal'Dranath. As Thal'Dranath became the broken shore they're probably wrecked beyond recognition.
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Old 02-08-2017, 09:07 AM
Ethenil Ethenil is offline

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In my headcanon, now that the Broken islands were always there and the Islands-that-werent-in-Maiev's-maps refers to the Broken Shore, Izal-Shural library and Arauk-Nashal gardens were retconned as being parts of Thal'Dranath. As Thal'Dranath became the broken shore they're probably wrecked beyond recognition.
Indeed, by the Black City.

However, there's also the name 'Nashal' that is present in Stormheim. Could be a vrykul trophy, a statue of Nashal the Watcher displayed in a garden of Suramar?

Izal-Shurah also sounds quite a bit like Val'Sharah.
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